Curved screen... please no!

[Doktor Oswaldo 904]

Dakkaron wrote:

I think it’s completely beside the point to use a curved screen to make it look cool for a wider audience. This phone is made specifically FOR the dinosaurs. Who else would buy a keyboard phone? The “kids these days” don’t care about a keyboard. It’s just not cool anymore.

We might be dinosaurs, but I at the least do not want to go back to neither monochrome, non-touch nor vga… ;).

 

So I hope we all agree that we want a modernised version not a replica of what we had.

 

I personally don’t have neither a strong urge for nor grudge against curved screens. As I wrote earlier I did dislike them until I actually got a device with it (Priv), and found my fears of the discomfort to be hugely exaggerated.

 

On the pro-side it allows for a larger screen at the same size device, and allows for swipes on SailFish – and despite sounding odd I believe also easier to get and thus cheaper in 2019. On the con side it will be more exposed (and thus have a higher risk of breaking) and can give unwanted side-interactions.

 

Does one outweigh the other? Personally I’m not sure, but to each their own,

 

Before giving up on the curved, try to find a friend with e.g a Samsung S8+, S9+ or S10+, and borrow it to play around with for a few hours. as they are quite close to the same width.

 

To be clear, I will also buy it no matter what screen. I am glad that somebody builds a slider phone again, everything else is secondary.

But I doubt that the curved screen is cheaper. Most of the phones still have a flat screen, they have to be cheaper.

But could be a special deal or something, b2b is a strange market.

 

If it really is cheaper, sure go for it why not. But since I highly doubt that it seems like a rather strange decision.

The sources I posted earlier in this thread are indicating that not even Galaxy users really like the curved screen.

Put the money in a highly controversial special Gimmick and then go for an old chipset is unusual (not that I care, the chipset will handle my mailapp. But all the reviews out there say: "Oh it is great, if you can live with the old chipset").

 

So why it won't stop me from buying I can't comprehend why they did go that road.

 

P.S. The swipping on sailfish might be the first functional pro I saw in this thread. Has somebody a video or another source about that feature? Would appreciate it.

[EskeRahn 5,460]

P.S. The swipping on sailfish might be the first functional pro I saw in this thread. Has somebody a video or another source about that feature? Would appreciate it.

 

Never tried SailFish myself, but found this "Hands On & Demo" video from here

But can't see why this could not work on a 'bezelled' display also.

[Joakim 32]

I think this video pretty much demonstrates most of the functionalities of Sailfish 3:

 

Edge swiping is pretty much used for system wide commands: Swipe from the bottom brings up the app menu, Swipe from the left takes you to Notifications screen, Swipe from the right gets you to multitasking window. Swipe from up brings down a quick settings menu.

 

Some of these swipes can be reconfigured to some extend, but that pretty much describes the basic functionality. (For example, you can bind swiping from upper corners to closing currently running application)

 

 

[Doktor Oswaldo 904]

I think this video pretty much demonstrates most of the functionalities of Sailfish 3:

 

Edge swiping is pretty much used for system wide commands: Swipe from the bottom brings up the app menu, Swipe from the left takes you to Notifications screen, Swipe from the right gets you to multitasking window. Swipe from up brings down a quick settings menu.

 

Some of these swipes can be reconfigured to some extend, but that pretty much describes the basic functionality. (For example, you can bind swiping from upper corners to closing currently running application)

 

Thanks a lot. But this seems to be perfectly possible with a flat screen too.

[EskeRahn 5,460]

Thanks a lot. But this seems to be perfectly possible with a flat screen too.

 

I have the same feeling, though it might feel a little odd swiping between a continuous screen, and a protruding bezel, (either to or from the display). At least the bezel should feel smooth I guess.

[Doktor Oswaldo 904]

doktor.oswaldo wrote:

Thanks a lot. But this seems to be perfectly possible with a flat screen too.

I have the same feeling, though it might feel a little odd swiping between a continuous screen, and a protruding bezel, (either to or from the display). At least the bezel should feel smooth I guess.

 

I fear that swiping from the display to the edge is not that comfortable. You would probably need a lot of pressure to not lose contact with your thumb. So I guess the swiping must ignore the curved part.

Edge-only swiping could be a useful feature (scroll through open apps). But it seems that Neither Sailfish nor Android are adding any functionality to the edge. Even Samsung removed it because nobody used it anyway (as far as I know that was the reason).

If the Edge does anything at all to swiping it seems to be interfering with it in my opinion.

But since somebody said it would help I would love to hear other views to that.

[EskeRahn 5,460]

I fear that swiping from the display to the edge is not that comfortable. You would probably need a lot of pressure to not lose contact with your thumb. So I guess the swiping must ignore the curved part.

 

I guess it matters how the logic work, and how dense the sensor-grid of the display really is, It might not matter if it ends a few pixel before the actual edge. But of course if Sailfish expect the movement to go all the way, and the sensor grid is only a few pixels wide, it might be a problem to get to correctly trigger the outermost touch sensors of a display with protruding bezels.

[Doktor Oswaldo 904]

doktor.oswaldo wrote:

I fear that swiping from the display to the edge is not that comfortable. You would probably need a lot of pressure to not lose contact with your thumb. So I guess the swiping must ignore the curved part.

I guess it matters how the logic work, and how dense the sensor-grid of the display really is, It might not matter if it ends a few pixel before the actual edge. But of course if Sailfish expect the movement to go all the way, and the sensor grid is only a few pixels wide, it might be a problem to get to correctly trigger the outermost touch sensors of a display with protruding bezels.

 

Exactly what I mean. But if it ends before the edge, the edged part of the display is again unused.

 

On another Note on this Topic: The new Samsung Galaxy S10 will have a Lite edition (S10e) with a flat screen!

So Samsung the shiny knight of curved screens does think there are people who want a flat screen or at least buy it even with a flat screen. But the real interesting thing is, it is the cheapest model which has the flat screen.

So it seems to be indeed cheaper, even for Samsung, to have a flat screen.

This does not 100% mean that it is the same for this phone (Samsung manufactures the screens themselves), but chances are pretty high that a flat screen would have been cheaper.

[EskeRahn 5,460]

On another Note on this Topic: The new Samsung Galaxy S10 will have a Lite edition (S10e) with a flat screen!

So Samsung the shiny knight of curved screens does think there are people who want a flat screen or at least buy it even with a flat screen. But the real interesting thing is, it is the cheapest model which has the flat screen.

So it seems to be indeed cheaper, even for Samsung, to have a flat screen.

This does not 100% mean that it is the same for this phone (Samsung manufactures the screens themselves), but chances are pretty high that a flat screen would have been cheaper.

 

Uh, I guess there are many factors in play here, And we can for part of it only guess on the "why"s. Sure when Samsung produce the display themselves, and in large quanta specifically for each model, the flat is likely to be cheaper. But the Pro¹ is going to use already existing 'standard' components, due to not expecting to sell multiple millions. And it might be that the number of displays in the right size, quality and resolution is quite limited, and curved are prevailing thus influencing the prices.

Also remember that Samsung wants the S10e to be less desirable than the more expensive versions, to have a price-ladder. And that might be part of their calculation to keep the models apart to use what they expect people to see as a less desirable display. The same way they use a different camera setup.

 

(But as I said those are of course just guesses on the "why"s)

[Joakim 32]

To be fair, if we talk about costs, doing major overhaul on the design and what big parts to use (logic board, screen etc), is most definitely going to increase cost or even delay the phone's release. Screens are one of the biggest hurdles when manufacturing a phone/tablet. Assembly lines need to be preconfigured to these very specific demands well before the manufacturing starts. Not to mention about preordering the components. These factories are usually fully booked all the time, so missing a manufacturing deadline can delay product for months and it eats all the possible profit.

 

Jolla Tablet is a prime example of such failure where they had to change some major parts in their device two times (both times were even things that were not under their control). These setbacks eventually drainer the company from money. In the end, they were able to provide a tablet to some of their customers, but most were offered a refund of some sorts.

 

Not only that, but fxtec is pretty much creating pre-orders for this phone with these specific "looks" in mind. If they were to change those, we do not know how many "silent" customers would dropout. Gimmick or not, it's still quite big part of the product they are trying to sell. In addition, if they were to keep the design, but decreased the screen size (since flat screen would need to be smaller to fit), it would a point where buyer might either refund or cancel their orders. Not to mention that these new versions would require some sort of prototyping versions. Pretty much now since shipment is planned to start on July.

 

There are multiple other smaller points, but these are little bit major ones. I don't want to sound mean, but it's different to ask changes to some not-so "impactful" parts like keyboard, but changes that alter either the look of the phone, significantly increase manufacturing cost or have a change of delaying the launch are most likely not going to happen.

[EskeRahn 5,460]

....but changes that alter either the look of the phone, significantly increase manufacturing cost or have a change of delaying the launch are most likely not going to happen.

I totally agree with you. I think the "door" to all this opened as they said that it was their intention to replace the screen with a different one than the one that was on the prototypes presented in Barcelona during MWC. But this was back in February, So I would be very surprised if they here in April had not long settled on a specific display - and likely have been preparing the production for it too. And if that was a principal different type of display, I'm pretty sure we would have heard more on it. Though it could be ever so slightly thicker/thinner or larger/smaller than what was on the prototypes.

[Doktor Oswaldo 904]

To be totally clear.

I am quite happy with the phone as it is.

I am aware that it is impossible to change the screen now. Of course. And if they would I would say: "Well thats way too late. It is gonna get problems".

And I also know that i can't know for sure which version would be cheaper for fx.

 

All I say at the moment is: It is unlikely to be cheaper (but possible) and they should go for a flat screen in the next iteration (in my opinion).

 

The reason why I am keeping this Issue alive is because I want to understand the decision. I am keen to know if there are any real advantages of the curved screen. I may even be wrong. But it seems to me, that it was a "we want to make clear, that the phone has a keyboard AND is modern"-decision. That may or may not be a stupid decision but it is fine. If this is the biggest design flaw of the phone it will be the best phone out there (all other phones have the no-keyboard-slider-flaw).

 

But this Forum is for Feedback. And my Feedback is: a curved screen is useless in my opinion. And i gonna buy it anyway.

I am not a young social-media-troll who demands stuff from companies. I am an grown-ass smarty-pants which throws around his opinion no matter if anybody wants to hear it ;-)

 

[TeZtdevice 297]

+1 for curved screens

 

I love it !!!

Don´t change the screen.

[EskeRahn 5,460]

...But this Forum is for Feedback...

Exactly, and I hope it did not seem I wanted to stop the discussion.

As it is for sure valuable input to how a next generation (that I hope will come) should be in say a year or two.

 

We are at the same pace I think. Would personally prefer a screen with protective bezels. BUT if curved screens can wheel in more buyers, then fine with me. As with the keyboard trying to monetize the "prefer", I would not pay £200 more to get it with a flat screen, but £50 I would.

[Joakim 32]

Seems like the pre-production screens are here:

 

 

[EskeRahn 5,460]

Seems like the pre-production screens are here:

 

Unboxing time! Getting our new screen ready for a small production run of the Pro1. We’ve upgraded the screen of the Pro1 to the same supplier as Huawei’s folding phone. More updates over the next week.

#Pro1

#FunctionisKey

#qwerty

#hwkb

#fxtec

pic.twitter.com/a2sOABRgXR

 

— F(x)tec (@thefxtec)

April 20, 2019

https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js

 

Yup and from the number on the display (BF060Y8M-AJ0-7702), we can see that it is the one used also on "Elephone U Pro", see e.g. this. And there already are screen protectors for that one - so one concern less. :)

 

PS: It should even be Gorilla Glass 5. That is not 3 as the early preproduction units.

[IraSeigel 0]

 

Yup and from the number on the display (BF060Y8M-AJ0-7702), we can see that it is the one used also on “Elephone U Pro”, see e.g. this. And there already are screen protectors for that one – so one concern less. :)

 

Could you please provide a link to that screen protector? Thanks.

 

 

[dave 0]

Hi FXTec,

 

I just canceld my pre-order, let me shortly explain why....

There is only talk on this forum, no action, and I dont see anymore news.

Only talking on this forum about the pro's and con's won't do the job for anybody.

The people have spoken for and against a curved screen, I hope you take this customer feedback and do something with it.

I have read this forum now multiple times over and over.

I dont like the waste of time and that you guys dont listen, only making things more complex.

The choise is still very simple.. as soon the PDA is on the market (still taking a looong time) I will test it, hold it, look if there are handeling-issues or video not showing properly, or a few mm of useless screen space, with a curved screen and then I will make a dissicion.

So, for now I'm out.

Good luck with your company

 

 

[EskeRahn 5,460]

Yup and from the number on the display (BF060Y8M-AJ0-7702), we can see that it is the one used also on “Elephone U Pro”, see e.g.

this

. And there already are screen protectors for that one – so one concern less. :)

Could you please provide a link to that screen protector? Thanks.

 

Ah well just did a little search on Google and ebay for "Elephone U PRO", and ordered a couple of each of these three variants. 1, 2 & 3

But there are several others vendors out there, and I have NO idea if the ones I bought are good or bad. So not endorsing them, just picked at random, to be sure I had some protection from day one.

 

Note that none of the ones I found are curved tempered glass. So I hope F(x)tec (or perhaps Elephone?) would entice someone to make curved tempered glass protectors for them.

[TeZtdevice 297]

Hi FXTec,

 

I just canceld my pre-order, let me shortly explain why….

 

There is only talk on this forum, no action, and I dont see anymore news.

 

Only talking on this forum about the pro’s and con’s won’t do the job for anybody.

 

The people have spoken for and against a curved screen, I hope you take this customer feedback and do something with it.

 

I have read this forum now multiple times over and over.

 

I dont like the waste of time and that you guys dont listen, only making things more complex.

 

The choise is still very simple.. as soon the PDA is on the market (still taking a looong time) I will test it, hold it, look if there are handeling-issues or video not showing properly, or a few mm of useless screen space, with a curved screen and then I will make a dissicion.

 

So, for now I’m out.

 

Good luck with your company

 

Why??

The phone will be released in July.

At this moment, one of the fxtec members is at Taipei to check the production. You can see the actually tweets.

Just relaxed... you ordered but didn't pay the bill :-)

Everyone who ordered the phone will it asap, however it's a new company, new phone with missed function... let the dream alive with your preorder. ;-)

[EskeRahn 5,460]

Hi FXTec,

 

I just canceld my pre-order, let me shortly explain why….

 

There is only talk on this forum, no action, and I dont see anymore news.

 

Only talking on this forum about the pro’s and con’s won’t do the job for anybody.

 

The people have spoken for and against a curved screen, I hope you take this customer feedback and do something with it.

 

I have read this forum now multiple times over and over.

 

I dont like the waste of time and that you guys dont listen, only making things more complex.

 

The choise is still very simple.. as soon the PDA is on the market (still taking a looong time) I will test it, hold it, look if there are handeling-issues or video not showing properly, or a few mm of useless screen space, with a curved screen and then I will make a dissicion.

 

So, for now I’m out.

 

Good luck with your company

 

Would be interesting to know what you expected from a forum just a few months before release. Did you expect that we could influence any substantial hardware changes at this late stage?

I think that we might influence a bit on things like the print on the keys (see e.g. the thread on the German QWERTZ keyboard)

And we might be able to influence the software, if we can come up with some useful ideas, that are not too far from what they already have made.

 

Many of the wishes for how things could be different hardware-wise, I see that as input for a Pro2 (if they will make one).

 

Once we got the device in our hands, the forum is likely to be more active. Hopefully there are not too many bugs, But the forum could help out with collecting info on known bugs, and perhaps sharing workarounds until fixed.

 

I also expect that there will be something for sharing different keyboard layouts (complete or partial ones).

 

And in general feedback or questions on how to get the most of the device. e.g. recommend apps especially well suited for landscape keyboard devices.

 

....But that said, I'm not a twitter-guy, and would MUCH prefer to have the tweets duplicated in here -as they did with the early news-letters- so I did not need to use that silly platform to get the info. I hate Twitter almost as much as fakebooks.

[netman 1,424]

I do agree with EskeRahn here, also there's a lot of action and listening here compared to the "competition" as far as that exists.

[kashif 350]

Well i dont understand why so many are not happy with curve screen and looks like it has the largest number of posts.

 

I think curved screen is a good choice. it can be used very efficiently for pulling side menus, maybe displaying side notifications and would also gives a smooth swiping experience.

 

I currently also have galaxy note 8 besides Nokia E7. i can tell you that galaxy note 8 with curved screen feels much better and works much better with swiping and fingers. and it also does look nice.

[Doktor Oswaldo 904]

Well i dont understand why so many are not happy with curve screen and looks like it has the largest number of posts.

 

I think curved screen is a good choice. it can be used very efficiently for pulling side menus, maybe displaying side notifications and would also gives a smooth swiping experience.

 

I currently also have galaxy note 8 besides Nokia E7. i can tell you that galaxy note 8 with curved screen feels much better and works much better with swiping and fingers. and it also does look nice.

 

To be fair, the galaxy note 8 is way newer than the nokia E7. In these 6 years touchscreens have evolved a lot. Haptic feedback is way better, they are faster, smoother and so on. To put this on the curved screen is most certainly wrong.

 

I completely agree with you that it could be used efficiently with special functions for the curved part. But until now I do not see anything like that.

 

The drawbacks however are known and clear. that makes it hard for some people to understand the decision. But we will have to see, maybe the curved screen will be great.

[EskeRahn 5,460]

kashif wrote:

Well i dont understand why so many are not happy with curve screen and looks like it has the largest number of posts.

 

I think curved screen is a good choice. it can be used very efficiently for pulling side menus, maybe displaying side notifications and would also gives a smooth swiping experience.

 

I currently also have galaxy note 8 besides Nokia E7. i can tell you that galaxy note 8 with curved screen feels much better and works much better with swiping and fingers. and it also does look nice.

To be fair, the galaxy note 8 is way newer than the nokia E7. In these 6 years touchscreens have evolved a lot. Haptic feedback is way better, they are faster, smoother and so on. To put this on the curved screen is most certainly wrong.

 

I completely agree with you that it could be used efficiently with special functions for the curved part. But until now I do not see anything like that.

 

The drawbacks however are known and clear. that makes it hard for some people to understand the decision. But we will have to see, maybe the curved screen will be great.

 

As said earlier I see that on one hand a flat screen with substantial mechanical metal bezels would be better protected on edge impacts.

On the other that would (keeping all else the same) require a lesser display area and make the device about 1mm thicker, thus making it look even more of something out of the past. And my GUESS would be that the guys designing this after careful considerations have decided in favour of the edged design.

Remember that for many people looks is still a big thing (fashion in clothing is strangely important for a LOT of people). So if they felt the looks to be embarrassingly old fashioned, that just MIGHT lead to some not buying it, despite wanting a real keyboard. On the other hand, I doubt that many would feel the edges so much a deal breaker that this would stop them from buying it.

 

I do not know of any functional benefits of a curved screen on Android though, but as I understand Sailfish there might be some here.

 

I DO hope they will make some software/firmware solution that would allow the users having problems with grip and edges to seletc zones ignoring touch. Perhaps not from day one, but if enough people would report is as a real problem.