MickH 212 Posted July 18, 2020 Share Posted July 18, 2020 We already have an "Alternative to wireless charging" topic. But this is specifically about full wireless charging. Wireless charging QI receivers are easily available for type-C from Amazon. These are installed by just sticking the receiver to the back of the phone and plugging in the connector. I have an idea of sticking the receiver to the inside back of my flip case (instead of to the phone itself). Question is. Would wireless charging work on the Pro1 or is there a lot more involved, like the need for additional software/app support for the Pro1? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
EskeRahn 5,471 Posted July 18, 2020 Share Posted July 18, 2020 46 minutes ago, MickH said: We already have an "Alternative to wireless charging" topic. But this is specifically about full wireless charging. Wireless charging QI receivers are easily available for type-C from Amazon. These are installed by just sticking the receiver to the back of the phone and plugging in the connector. I have an idea of sticking the receiver to the inside back of my flip case (instead of to the phone itself). Question is. Would wireless charging work on the Pro1 or is there a lot more involved, like the need for additional software/app support for the Pro1? I think it would work just fine, and I believe someone in here have actually done it, unless my memory fails me. BUT note that the off centre placement of the USB-plug might make it hard to place in a suitable way, as they most likely will come with a flat cable. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
MickH 212 Posted July 18, 2020 Author Share Posted July 18, 2020 The off-centre port could be an issue. I've seen a few with longer lead offs so a slight modification could be made with some careful folding. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
SchattengestaIt 559 Posted July 18, 2020 Share Posted July 18, 2020 I have upgraded my Droid 4 back then with a wireless charger. Unmounted the charging coil from a wireless charging backplate of another phone and glued it onto the battery. The backplate actually did fit since it was around 1mm thin. I connected the output directly to the 4 pin connector on the back (no idea what it was for in the first place) which ran on the same line as the USB input. So that should definitely work and I guess it would be quite slim. Does the upgrade option come with a flat USB C adapter so it won't be in the way while holding/using the phone? Also, I don't know how the product is designed. But if you wind up the coil by a centimeter, you would have more than enough 'cable' to connect it to the USB port. If glued together after that this should last a while. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
DieBruine 397 Posted July 19, 2020 Share Posted July 19, 2020 No it will not work! Unfortunately it does not seem to work on newer phones. I own a few of these wireless pads, different brands. When connected, they lit up the charging LED, but they do not actually charge the phone. This is also the case with for example the Sony XZ1c. It does work on a Sony XZs. Both the Pro1 and the XZ1 act like they are connected to a charger, but do not charge when placed on a wireless charger. This was tested with BaseUs and Samsung wireless charger, both QC and regular. I think they power delivery is too weak. That is why both phones won't charge. The XZs charges really slow. I don't have that phone anymore so I cannot give you exact numbers. I haven't tried any new pads, wish I could find a working one. My wireless BaseUs car holder works really well. Now if it could just charge my phone also 😅 2 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
daniel.schaaaf 177 Posted July 19, 2020 Share Posted July 19, 2020 I'd be careful playing with QI: DiodeGoneWild: Wireless Qi Charger (sets your phone on fire) Quote Link to post Share on other sites
netman 1,424 Posted July 19, 2020 Share Posted July 19, 2020 50 minutes ago, daniel.schaaaf said: I'd be careful playing with QI: DiodeGoneWild: Wireless Qi Charger (sets your phone on fire) Definitely be careful with cheap garbage in general 😅 3 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
DieBruine 397 Posted July 19, 2020 Share Posted July 19, 2020 Well, i for one would not refer to BaseUs as cheap garbage. I truly trust their hardware. Nonetheless, if someone finds a wireless pad that does function with newer phones, I would like to be informed. 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
MickH 212 Posted July 22, 2020 Author Share Posted July 22, 2020 (edited) Hmmmm.... 🤔 Looks like there's a bit of homework to be done on this. Thanks for the input all. 👍 Edited July 22, 2020 by MickH Quote Link to post Share on other sites
DieBruine 397 Posted July 22, 2020 Share Posted July 22, 2020 My setup... Only found out later that it won't charge the Pro1. Hardware: Quote Link to post Share on other sites
EskeRahn 5,471 Posted July 22, 2020 Share Posted July 22, 2020 10 minutes ago, DieBruine said: My setup... Only found out later that it won't charge the Pro1. Ah... So that was It, too bad... 😥 I was sure I read somewhere that someone had done it. ☺️ Just a guess. Could it be that the metal back disturbs the magnetic field so it can still 'see' it but can not really transfer power? For the test it could be interesting to see if it charges free in the air not attached to the back (though obviously useless for real usage). Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Zamasu 258 Posted July 22, 2020 Share Posted July 22, 2020 My guess is that the wireless pad just won't supply enough power to charge the phone, but enough to trigger the LED. That was often the case on my previous phone, with the added bonus of still heating it up... They're really not that efficient, and depending on what you plug it into it might just not be enough to offset the power needed to keep the phone on. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
DieBruine 397 Posted July 22, 2020 Share Posted July 22, 2020 (edited) No way. As I stated, I own a regular wireless charger (Samsung) and three quick chargers (Samsung & BaseUs). Also two car holders with quick chargers (BaseUs). It's the same pad that worked on Priv and XZs. Same meaning exactly that same one (XZs). Just to humor you I just connected it to my Pro1, placed the pad on the quick charger and left it for 15 minutes. Power went down 2% 😥 No metal interference whatsoever. The BaseUs pad I'm using claims an output of 5V 1A. That was enough to charge my XZs in, if I recall correctly, 3.5 to 4.5 hours. No it wasn't fast, but I wasn't in a hurry. Slow overnight charge and the additional bonus of charging it while placed in my holder was what I was going for. Just looked it up, XZs has a 2900mAh battery versus 3200mAh in the Pro1. I could live with a slow 5 hour charge. Is there anyone with the right equipment to find out what the minimum charging voltage and current needs to be? Clearly 5V 1A ain't gonna cut it. Edited July 22, 2020 by DieBruine 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
EskeRahn 5,471 Posted July 22, 2020 Share Posted July 22, 2020 You might have to roughly half the charger output to what the phone recieves wirelessly - at best 75% (hence the heating with wireless charging) but I know that the phone can charge slowly with 5V 500ma. I will see if I can find an old 300ma charger in a drawer... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
EskeRahn 5,471 Posted July 22, 2020 Share Posted July 22, 2020 To see what charge is sentto/pulled fromthe battery, you con try to install an app like 3C Battery Monitor (also part af a larger all-in-one toolbox, i can also highly recommend) It does NOT tell how much gets delivered to the port though. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Zamasu 258 Posted July 23, 2020 Share Posted July 23, 2020 I could definitely be wrong yes, just wanted to share my experience with wireless chargers. In my experience they were also extremely fickle and not consistent at all. Sometimes it would just charge fine, other times I'd return to a hot and nearly empty phone. Again guessing here, but I think it might've been some slight differences in what software was running in the background. This was an LG G3 on a LG charging dock by the way, so even more reason for it to just work. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
_DW_ 628 Posted July 23, 2020 Share Posted July 23, 2020 Yeah its entirely possible for it to draw all the power been supplied by the charger. Try putting in battery saver before trying a wireless charge. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
EskeRahn 5,471 Posted July 23, 2020 Share Posted July 23, 2020 2 hours ago, _DW_ said: Yeah its entirely possible for it to draw all the power been supplied by the charger. Try putting in battery saver before trying a wireless charge. The Wireless charger may pull all the power, but it will not be transfer all of it wireless Even in ideal condition and with a common iron core (like a transformer) magnetic transfer will have substantial loss. (Unless we are talking generally and include super conductors). But obviously the phone must be able to handshake through a protocol supported by the charger, e.g. Qi. We do not know what protocols the Pro1 supports here. It might only be some so basic that it can not request a reasonable amount of power from the charger. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
DieBruine 397 Posted July 23, 2020 Share Posted July 23, 2020 (edited) So, tried the suggestion. I enabled battery saver and flight mode. It charged from 68% to 69% in 15 minutes 😒. Looked up further specs, trying to figure out why it worked on in combination with the Sony XZs. The CPU is an 820 with a 2900mAh battery. It does not work on the Sony XZ1 compact, which sports the exact same CPU as the Pro1. I have to say I am surprised that it works acceptabel(y) well on the 820, but not the 835 🤔. And I agree with the thought this may be due to a handshake of some sorts. Edited July 23, 2020 by DieBruine 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
daniel.schaaaf 177 Posted July 24, 2020 Share Posted July 24, 2020 There's not a whole lot of information out there on BaseUs. Here is one review that seems legitimate: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AmHqG-uKGHs In my experience with a MotoZ Play and our Pro1, fast charging is quite detrimential to batteries due to the waste heat being generated. A QI charger will make things worse, when it is in close vicinity to the battery it is charging. I also suspect that cheap, or cheapish, third party solutions use low switching frequencies and less efficient voltage converters. Both, the QI sender and receiver, will produce a lot of waste heat, which adds to the heat from the battery charging and the phone running tasks like a navigation app. If the phone is mounted on an air duct blowing cold air, QI might work. But, as soon as the phone charging circuit demands too much power, and the QI device does not communicate its maximum output power to the phone correctly, things get hot quickly. All in all, I would not recommend any third party QI solution. I charge my phone only with it resting on some metal surface for cooling, and I stop charging at 90 %. In my opinion, factory charging policies are safe to use, but they are designed to push lithium battery technology to its chemical and thermal limits and degrade our batteries (roughly) 10x faster than necessary. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
EskeRahn 5,471 Posted July 24, 2020 Share Posted July 24, 2020 2 hours ago, daniel.schaaaf said: All in all, I would not recommend any third party QI solution. I charge my phone only with it resting on some metal surface for cooling, and I stop charging at 90 %. In my opinion, factory charging policies are safe to use, but they are designed to push lithium battery technology to its chemical and thermal limits and degrade our batteries (roughly) 10x faster than necessary. I would really wish for some more user friendly flexible solutions. So you could easily use fast charging when you need it, and avoid it in daily usage. Sure you can just use different chargers, but the average user is not going to mess with that. It would be better if you only had one fast charger, and when connecting we would get a pop up with some objective message like "Fast charging shortens the overall battery life. Do you need the charging to be fast this time Yes/No" And perhaps with some estimates helping people to decide related to the actual situation. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Swond 120 Posted July 24, 2020 Share Posted July 24, 2020 6 minutes ago, EskeRahn said: "Fast charging shortens the overall battery life. Do you need the charging to be fast this time Yes/No" And some time estimation till the end of charging would be pretty cool: Fast: 1:30 / Normal: 2:45.. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
daniel.schaaaf 177 Posted July 24, 2020 Share Posted July 24, 2020 There are a lot of interesting files in /sys/class/power_supply/, which either show battery and USB data, or can be written to in order to control the charging process. I had an Automate (https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.llamalab.automate) script, that would stop charging at 90 % on my MotoZ Play. Unfortunately, I did not have the time to make a script for the Pro1. If you are willing to wait for a few months, I might post a script here ... 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
LIMA 35 Posted January 13, 2021 Share Posted January 13, 2021 I want to share my experience regarding the wireless charge. I am using Pro 1 running LinageOS 17.1 (Android 10). I bought two wireless receivers from Amazon, Japan. I tried it without a case/cover. Left: Output 800-1000mA / Light turns on, but don't charge. https://www.amazon.co.jp/gp/product/B08P2N5M1Q/ Right: Output 1300mA Max / Light turns on, able to charge, displaying [charging slowly] 🙂https://www.amazon.co.jp/gp/product/B088NRBHBP/ While charging, the receiver makes a small noise from the coil, and it is a bit annoying in a quiet environment. I used Belkin charging pad WIA001dqBK-A and also NANAMI HM001 charger for charging, and both worked. I feel like Belkin is charging faster. It is slow, but it doesn't matter much for me unless I can charge my Pro1 on the desktop while working hours. I am currently trying removable sticky tape to attach receiver on Pro1 and it works fine. 1 4 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
DieBruine 397 Posted January 13, 2021 Share Posted January 13, 2021 Around €30,- from UK to NL. That's about 10,- too much for me. But thanks for sharing. It would be very nice if I could charge my phone wireless in my car. Hopefully 1300mAh will become more common soon. 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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