Price ​ ​ .

[EskeRahn 5,459]

I didn’t think the price was necessarily going to go up after pre-order, that is the first I’d heard of that. Most of what we’ve seen says its going to be 649. And everyone agrees its kinda expensive, but we’re willing to pay for it for the keyboard and understand the reason the price is high (R&D and niche market so not high volume).

 

But I really hope the price doesn’t go up immediately or else nobody else is gunna buy it. All the keyboard fanactics have already sent their money. There may still be a few out there who haven’t heard about this device, but not as many. So in order to keep getting sales and for the success of this company, I hope they don’t raise the price.

 

It is hard for us outside to know how they are going about all this, so we are just guessing. My guess is that as a startup their financing is limited, so I will not be surprised if the first batch produced is not much beyond the pre-ordered (plus spares for repair/swap). We can only hope that once people see the real stuff and it get some publicity, they will get an overwhelming number of orders in, but if not it is likely that later batches will be of smaller size and thus the unit cost price they have to pay for everything will be (even) higher...

[netman 1,424]

Saying that Pro1 has 3 years old spec is a really wrong statement because the screen, RAM and storage is completely fine.

And 3 year old phone has no keypad except meh bb priv, in this regard Pro1 has no competition... Unihertz Titan and BB Key2 exist but jeez, those you could actually complain about the specs with.

 

When it comes to SD835, you only need better one if you need 802.11ay for getting max speed offered by 5G, 4k @ 60fps video capture, being able to playing most GPU hungry android games at max details for a long time, VR or you want to use phone for AI.

And that only even helps if you live in a place which has the infrastructure, which are not most places as far as I know. I think SD835 is an excellent choice, more than fast enough and it is cheaper than the newest not-noticably-faster chips.

 

Another thing, comparing Fxtec Pro1 specs to Xiaomi is really unfair.

One CAN compare a Toyota car to Bentley... And similarly Pro1 won't be for everyone and neither are Xiaomi phones, we all can take our choice.

[MortisAngelus 2]

Saying that Pro1 has 3 years old spec is a really wrong statement because the screen, RAM and storage is completely fine. SD835 is a 2017 CPU, which isn’t 3 years old. Pro1 camera is used also in 2019 phones.

 

Anyway, the price isn’t that bad if you compare it to BlackBerry Key2, the only current physical keyboard alternative, which costs even more than Pro1 and it had only 64GB memory and SD660 which is weaker than SD835. Also, Key2 isn’t made for video watching and is meh in landscape.

 

When it comes to SD835, you only need better one if you need 802.11ay for getting max speed offered by 5G, 4k @ 60fps video capture, being able to playing most GPU hungry android games at max details for a long time, VR or you want to use phone for AI. If not, then SD835 is completely fine and it won’t be that different from newer ones.

 

Another thing, comparing Fxtec Pro1 specs to Xiaomi is really unfair. Xiaomi got popular because it offers the highest specs for the lowest price possible, the probably have strategies to cut the manufacturing price where possible. Expecting that a small company that will only create few dozen thousands of phones should put the same price tag as Xiaomi is just unfair.

 

It is not a matter of "Do I need better specs", it is about "Value FOR the specs". I am completely fine currently with my 821 chip. But I would not want to pay 600 EUR for one now. And no, I don't think the comparison to Xiaomi is unfair at all. If they can provide 2019 specs at 300 dollars, then a small company should be able to provide 2017 (thanks for the correction btw) specs at 300 dollars and then add in the costs for keyboard development and lower numbers. So say 500 dollars. Again, I can accept the 650 eur price, because that is what it was set out to be, but not more. Absolutely not more.

 

The inherent problem so far, which was one of the first threads I ever made here, is the lack of proper communication from FxTec and their contradicting information.

 

It is extremely annoying that they first tell you "pay whenever your phone model comes out", and then they change that. Then they tell you "Scandi will be made later after QWERTZ", and I'm like "Fine by me!". Then you get messages about "No Scandi will be made" followed by "Scandi is under consideration". It is this lack of clear communication to us, the community and customers, that makes me lose trust in companies. What's more, when they gave me a statement that "We always mention keyboards are introduced by demand" (and Scandi is very demanded), they also tell me not to share any of these statements online - like they are afraid of keeping the people informed. This is always a red flag for me. If a company can't stand for what they tell their customers in private mails, and are afraid of it going online on THEIR OWN FORUM, then there is not much to trust, imo.

 

I might have to cancel my pre-order, because I am not at all convinced anymore. If they could promise EITHER that there will be a SCANDI version or that I can wait with my payment without having to pay more, then I could stay. But if they force me to pay 650 now for a phone I don't even know will exist, that doesn't feel too good of a deal to me anymore.

 

 

@EskeRahn: Yes, it is normal for pre-orders to be a bit cheaper, but they NEVER said that was the case with the Pro1. They only said, that it was to ensure you get yours first. They never said it was at a lower price. And frankly, I don't think anyone - including you - expected the phone to go even higher in price.

[EskeRahn 5,459]

@eskerahn: Yes, it is normal for pre-orders to be a bit cheaper, but they NEVER said that was the case with the Pro1. They only said, that it was to ensure you get yours first. They never said it was at a lower price. And frankly, I don’t think anyone – including you – expected the phone to go even higher in price.

 

Well I actually DID expect it to go up! I have always seen this like a 'deluxe' version of a crowdfunded project, where they took all the risk of the development, and only asking for money when they felt sure they could deliver.

 

I'm confused on your question on the Scandi, as you yourself posted a reply from staff from August 9, that there WILL be a Scandinavian layout. Though from where to count these "several weeks" is unclear, but my assumption is several weeks after the shipment of the US/German version.

 

The rest is better answered by someone in the staff.

[MortisAngelus 2]

Gon009 wrote:

Saying that Pro1 has 3 years old spec is a really wrong statement because the screen, RAM and storage is completely fine.

And 3 year old phone has no keypad except meh bb priv, in this regard Pro1 has no competition… Unihertz Titan and BB Key2 exist but jeez, those you could actually complain about the specs with.

 

Gon009 wrote:

When it comes to SD835, you only need better one if you need 802.11ay for getting max speed offered by 5G, 4k @ 60fps video capture, being able to playing most GPU hungry android games at max details for a long time, VR or you want to use phone for AI.

And that only even helps if you live in a place which has the infrastructure, which are not most places as far as I know. I think SD835 is an excellent choice, more than fast enough and it is cheaper than the newest not-noticably-faster chips.

 

Gon009 wrote:

Another thing, comparing Fxtec Pro1 specs to Xiaomi is really unfair.

One CAN compare a Toyota car to Bentley… And similarly Pro1 won’t be for everyone and neither are Xiaomi phones, we all can take our choice.

 

Again, you completely ignore (either by choice or by misunderstanding me) my point: I don't think the specs are not enough. I think they are overpriced. Just like a modern Flagship phone from Samsung and Apple too. I complain about them as much. No matter how much 855 you put into a phone, they shoulid not be 1000 dollars! Period.

 

Your analogy to toyota and bently does not really work, because toyota would be xiaomi and Bently would be FxTec in terms of target customer numbers. But whereas Bently provides the utter most luxury for their customers for a premium price, Toyota does not. Which is fair. But now we have Xiaomi providing all the luxuries (except the keyboard) for half the price of the FxTec. THAT is the issue for me.

[EskeRahn 5,459]

Your analogy to toyota and bently does not really work, because toyota would be xiaomi and Bently would be FxTec in terms of target customer numbers. But whereas Bently provides the utter most luxury for their customers for a premium price, Toyota does not. Which is fair. But now we have Xiaomi providing all the luxuries (except the keyboard) for half the price of the FxTec. THAT is the issue for me.

 

And you answered this yourself in the parentheses.... A completely crucial "except" that is the whole reason for the existence of this product.

[Doktor Oswaldo 904]

Please do not forget, that all 3 of the fxtec "directors" are probably using a lot of personal savings on this project. It is a big risk they are willing to take to bring the keyboard slider back (Even if it isn't their money, failing would at least mean have a failed company in your CW).

 

I for my part are thankful that somebody is willing to take that risk.

 

Yes the price is high, but as a lot others have pointed out it is hard to compare to other phones. But remember the money will not go to a multimillion dollar company, it will go to a start up.

 

If you still think that should be cheaper, feel free to produce a phone yourself. I would love some alternatives. If you are sure that the phone is to expensive, that should be riskfree =)

 

Sorry I don't want to mock anybody. It is a lot of money I know. And I feel sorry for everybody who wants a phone like that but could not spend that money on a phone with a clear conscience.

 

It may even be to expensive. It may be an aston martin. Way to expensive for what you get. You can get better cars for less money. But deep down you know you want one.

The difference here is, that if a [horizontal slider] keyboard is a must for you, you have no alternatives.

[MortisAngelus 2]

MortisAngelus wrote:

Your analogy to toyota and bently does not really work, because toyota would be xiaomi and Bently would be FxTec in terms of target customer numbers. But whereas Bently provides the utter most luxury for their customers for a premium price, Toyota does not. Which is fair. But now we have Xiaomi providing all the luxuries (except the keyboard) for half the price of the FxTec. THAT is the issue for me.

And you answered this yourself in the parentheses…. A completely crucial “except” that is the whole reason for the existence of this product.

 

I see your point, but ask yourself this: is the keyboard alone worth 350 dollars?

 

In regards to the statement above; Yes I posted that message about the info desk telling me that they would provide a scandi version. Simultaneously they told me I would pay when scandi come available, not before.

 

Now they tell me I have to pay before (unless I want to pay a higher price), and that they MIGHT make a SCANDI. That kind of "misinformation" is what annoys me.

[EskeRahn 5,459]

I see your point, but ask yourself this: is the keyboard alone worth 350 dollars?

 

In regards to the statement above; Yes I posted that message about the info desk telling me that they would provide a scandi version. Simultaneously they told me I would pay when scandi come available, not before.

 

Now they tell me I have to pay before (unless I want to pay a higher price), and that they MIGHT make a SCANDI. That kind of “misinformation” is what annoys me.

If it to me was not, I would not have ordered it. As simple as that…

 

But I do certainly agree with you that the information they provided to us around the Scandinavian keyboard is a mess.

[PanicBrothers 66]

Hey,

really stupid discussion.

 

It does not matter what it costs, it is important that it is worth to you.

Electronic is never a deal for save anything. Maybe tomorrow it is the half price or maybe you can buy soon a used Pro1 for 100 $ or maybe the sky is falling on our heads ;-)

 

I love to have something special and be one of the first Owner.

 

 

Regards

Panic Brothers

 

[netman 1,424]

I see your point, but ask yourself this: is the keyboard alone worth 350 dollars?

Absolutely yes, and I am probably paying a chunk of that to get it fast also (as opposed to waiting for a used one or prices to drop). I would also not be buying it otherwise, I am just fine with a 200eur phone if comparing non-keyboard phones. And if it was over 1000eur I might not buy it either, yet I wouldn't truely be offended.

[MortisAngelus 2]

Usually the preorders pay more and tech lose market value within months if not weeks. I was among the first pre-orders and now I’m not even in the queue. Why should I pay more to get last in line?

 

I have just reveived some more info about this topic from the info-mail, but I am in the process of asking for proper permission to share it with you on the forum. I also requested that someone from their staff would come in here and try to sort out our "mess" here in the forum and clear up misunderstandings both in this thread and in the Scandinavian Qwerty-thread.

 

Let's see what they reply.

[Doktor Oswaldo 904]

Chen posted a statement to the price increase on the mameo forum:

http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=1559275&postcount=1941

 

 

 

Thanks for all the support, criticise and help on clarification. Much appreciate the support from the community, it's the power for me to keep things moving.

 

We are undergoing for the first batch of production which will be finished shortly, but it's very limited in quantity. (I am sorry again to some people that we are not a massive entity that can afford a huge amount of first shipment) And meanwhile we are working on our second batch, which has also started. Please do bear in mind that in general, production including sourcing needs to be started 3-4 month before shipping. We are trying our best to reduce the gap for the following shipment. (And I am sure there will be more complaints from some that the waiting time is too long, in a bit of time. This is what we are trying to work out)

 

Unfortunately, since a few month ago, global and local politics are moving to a direction that is being very difficult to our little business. Trade war causing huge problems on sourcing components and shipping; Brexit and Sterling dropping into a stupidly low level; and there are a few extra license cost which we were not aware of at the beginning (can't disclose details publically) which also added a lot on individual cost. The price adjustment is a hard decision based on all the factors above. It more of making us survive, rather than making revenue. We always wanted to lower the price as much as possible so more users can get a chance to use the product, but there are cases that we cannot control.

 

However, that's said for all the pre-orders it would remain same as we promised if users pay on time. And once the situation of politics gets stabilised we will do the best to lower the price as much as we can.

 

 

[MortisAngelus 2]

Great news everyone! I got permission to share the conversation I've had with the team from FxTec here with you guys. Since the conversation is both about the pre-order pricing and about the Scandinavian keyboard I will post this same message in both threads, so sorry for the spam.

 

This provides some very much needed information, and clears up a lot of things and misconceptions in regards to when and how we are supposed to pay and if a SCANDI keyboard is in works or not. Enjoy the read! :D

 

[attachment file=32486]

 

[attachment file=32487]

 

[attachment file=32488]

 

[attachment file=32489]

 

 

[SHiSH 3]

Today price moved from 650 EUR to 778 EUR.

Can someone explain what happened?

At this price I have doubts that I will buy it.

 

[EskeRahn 5,459]

Can someone explain what happened?

 

Moved your post in here, see previous in this thread on the end of the initial discount.

[AnnieC 115]

While I understand the reasons for the price increase, I'm really sad. I felt that I cannot even justify spending 650 EUR on a phone so I did not pre-order and now it costs 20% more. See you next year. I just hope the battery in my MotoZ lasts that long.

[vlycop 38]

Does that mean the 650 prices make them lost money on the sell ? I meam i wouldn't have bought it for over 700, but i need that company to stay afloat if i want update and replacement part

[EskeRahn 5,459]

Does that mean the 650 prices make them lost money on the sell ? I meam i wouldn’t have bought it for over 700, but i need that company to stay afloat if i want update and replacement part

 

Well hard to know their reasons exactly, but COULD be a combination of several things. My guesses would be

1) An investment with a lower initial price to get the whole project off the ground, as most crowd-funded projects do too.

2) The pre-orders accumulate to a larger batch, that gives them a better unit price than when ordering small batches to fulfil later orders, as I doubt they have the capital to invest in a huge stock.

3) Caution for any Brexit-effects.

And I bet there are more to the list...

[DieBruine 397]

To be honest I just assumed any increase in price would have to do with Brexit and tensions between USA and PRC. Both are on the news regularly.

 

And while I agree the price increase is pretty steep, try to realize. Who in their sane mind would do such a thing were it not absolutely necessary!?

 

Blame Boris & Trump, BT 1.0.

 

I honestly feel bad for those who were unable to pre-order or day in time.

For this who were negligent, don't hash out on FxTec. Keep your dignity.

 

[nidajeny 0]

Today price moved from 650 EUR to 778 EUR.

 

Can someone explain what happened?

 

At this price I have doubts that I will buy it.

 

I’m out! Order a note10+ instead.

 

All the best to FX team.

 

[vlycop 38]

SHiSH wrote:

Today price moved from 650 EUR to 778 EUR.

 

Can someone explain what happened?

 

At this price I have doubts that I will buy it.

I’m out! Order a note10+ instead.

 

All the best to FX team.

 

I feel like if you can "live" with a note 10, you are not the audience for thia phone. It is niche, but it fulfil need no other manufacturers seam to care about. They are all more after what will look cool and not what is usefull.

But i understand dropping out because of the price.

[EskeRahn 5,459]

I feel like if you can “live” with a note 10, you are not the audience for thia phone.

 

Everyone have a limit for what the increased productive of a real keyboard is worth in cool cash. And who are any of us to judge others limits??

 

If a person had considered it at another price, they are clearly in the target audience of the device.

 

In my book target audience is defined be the personal usage patterns weighing of the pros of a real keyboard [EDIT: Plus repairability, open bootloader et cetera] versus the cons of the increased size and lacking features.

To some a pen may be a huge benefit, to others not. e.g.

[netman 1,424]

Slow down everyone! http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=1559923&postcount=2209

[VaZso 1,998]

I’m out! Order a note10+ instead.

 

All the best to FX team.

 

 

 

nidajeny wrote:

SHiSH wrote:

Today price moved from 650 EUR to 778 EUR.

 

Can someone explain what happened?

 

At this price I have doubts that I will buy it.

 

I’m out! Order a note10+ instead.

 

All the best to FX team.

I feel like if you can “live” with a note 10, you are not the audience for thia phone. It is niche, but it fulfil need no other manufacturers seam to care about. They are all more after what will look cool and not what is usefull.

 

But i understand dropping out because of the price.

 

Liangchen Chen has confirmed here that the price increase to 778 EUR was caused by an error, it should have been 649 EUR by now.

It will be fixed soon.