Doktor Oswaldo 904 Posted July 2, 2019 Share Posted July 2, 2019 I think a 1080p panel on a phone like this is to cheap out quite substantially, compared to my now 3 year old LG G6 with 1440p panel. It has a 2160 x 1080 (FHD+) panel not a 1080p. Okay it is a small difference in numbers but important for the form factor. Higher resolution also means higher power use, while adding not all to much more quality. To have a good panel is way more important than to have a higher resolutions on these small devices, the ppi is already high enough. I do not know if the panel is actually good, but i hope for a good brightness and a good black, than the resolution is more than enough Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Hook 2,945 Posted July 2, 2019 Share Posted July 2, 2019 MortisAngelus wrote: I think a 1080p panel on a phone like this is to cheap out quite substantially, compared to my now 3 year old LG G6 with 1440p panel. It has a 2160 x 1080 (FHD+) panel not a 1080p. Okay it is a small difference in numbers but important for the form factor. Higher resolution also means higher power use, while adding not all to much more quality. To have a good panel is way more important than to have a higher resolutions on these small devices, the ppi is already high enough. I do not know if the panel is actually good, but i hope for a good brightness and a good black, than the resolution is more than enough It's AMOLED, so I think you will get what you want. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
_DW_ 628 Posted July 2, 2019 Share Posted July 2, 2019 It really is time they did another blog post Quote Link to post Share on other sites
MortisAngelus 2 Posted July 2, 2019 Share Posted July 2, 2019 MortisAngelus wrote: I think a 1080p panel on a phone like this is to cheap out quite substantially, compared to my now 3 year old LG G6 with 1440p panel. It has a 2160 x 1080 (FHD+) panel not a 1080p. Okay it is a small difference in numbers but important for the form factor. Higher resolution also means higher power use, while adding not all to much more quality. To have a good panel is way more important than to have a higher resolutions on these small devices, the ppi is already high enough. I do not know if the panel is actually good, but i hope for a good brightness and a good black, than the resolution is more than enough I agree, that panel quality is more important. However, in 2019, there is no reason for compromising on either of them, especially at this price point. The display was just one example. Once you get used to working with a higher resolution it is difficult to go back; I picked up my old phone with 1920x1080 screen, and it does feel like the workspace is so limited compared to my LG. For apps with proper scaling this is not an issue, but e.g. I tried to take a screen shot of an e-mail from outlook app on both devices, and the lower screen resolution did indeed result in a much tighter-cut image. Can't say I liked that. :P Also, yes, the panel is FHD+, but it is still 1080p (vertical resolution - says nothing about horizontal resolution). EDIT: Okay, apparently 1080p is strictly meant for 1920x1080 (FHD).. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1080p#Resolutions Why do they do this? How do you then define something that is wider than 1920 pixels in a proper way? It is odd, considering FullHD is usually defined by the horizontal resolution: FHD movies in 21.5:9 aspect ratio are 1920x864 pixels, but are still marketed as 1080p movies.... Darn industry standards.... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
EskeRahn 5,427 Posted July 2, 2019 Share Posted July 2, 2019 I do not know if the panel is actually good, but i hope for a good brightness and a good black, than the resolution is more than enough See e.g TrustedReview on the Elephone U Pro with the same Boe display https://www.trustedreviews.com/reviews/elephone-u-pro Amazing 18:9 AMOLED display ...by equipping the U Pro with a punchy, 5.99-inch AMOLED panel (protected by Gorilla Glass 5, no less), which looks incredible from any angle. With an aspect ratio of 18:9 it’s tall and thin – which is the trend these days – and has a minimal bezel. It even has lovely rounded corners, which tie in perfectly with the pebble-like shape of the bodywork – at least from a design perspective. ADD Just browsed through a number of reviews https://www.google.com/search?q=elephone+u+pro+review+display And the one thing they all seem to agree on is that the display is really good... :) Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Hook 2,945 Posted July 2, 2019 Share Posted July 2, 2019 Also, yes, the panel is FHD+, but it is still 1080p (vertical resolution – says nothing about horizontal resolution). They say in the specs "5.99-inch 2160 x 1080 (FHD+) AMOLED" If I'm not mistaken, and I could be, 2160 is the vertical resolution and 1080 is the horizontal resolution. (assuming portrait orientation here) Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Doktor Oswaldo 904 Posted July 2, 2019 Share Posted July 2, 2019 I agree, that panel quality is more important. However, in 2019, there is no reason for compromising on either of them, especially at this price point. The display was just one example. Once you get used to working with a higher resolution it is difficult to go back; I picked up my old phone with 1920×1080 screen, and it does feel like the workspace is so limited compared to my LG. For apps with proper scaling this is not an issue, but e.g. I tried to take a screen shot of an e-mail from outlook app on both devices, and the lower screen resolution did indeed result in a much tighter-cut image. Can’t say I liked that. :P Sure, I agree, more resolution would be better. But again it should not be the focus of that phone, the keyboard should be. Sure it is expensive compared to "budget-china" phones. And I am using one of these at the moment. But I mean if you compare it to an iphone or a galaxy it is not that expensive. And the pro1 has actually something that makes it special. Sure I would never spend an iphone amount of money on a phone, and 650 is also on the more expensive site for me, but at least you get something. I mean if there would be a cheap phone with a keyboard I would maybe go for that, but there is no alternative here. But you are right for longer delays. It gets harder and harder to sell the price, if they need another year it will get critical. But a month or two is fine in my opinion. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Doktor Oswaldo 904 Posted July 2, 2019 Share Posted July 2, 2019 Just browsed through a number of reviews https://www.google.com/search?q=elephone+u+pro+review+display And the one thing they all seem to agree on is that the display is really good… :) Have a look at that one: https://www.devicespecifications.com/en/editor-review/6fbf6b/3 Brightness seems to be a bit low, but because the color and viewing angle are excellent it does not really have a big negative impact on readability. All in all it seems like a pretty good choice! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
netman 1,424 Posted July 2, 2019 Share Posted July 2, 2019 I'm also confident the display will be great. I have some phones with a FHD display and they can show fonts that are so tiny I need a loupe to see it yet when magnified the text is legible. At the point of 1080 pixels horizontal resolution on this size it's really up to the software whether that feels cramped or not, much higher resolution sacrifices battery life and needs more processing power to run things like games. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
MortisAngelus 2 Posted July 2, 2019 Share Posted July 2, 2019 MortisAngelus wrote: I agree, that panel quality is more important. However, in 2019, there is no reason for compromising on either of them, especially at this price point. The display was just one example. Once you get used to working with a higher resolution it is difficult to go back; I picked up my old phone with 1920×1080 screen, and it does feel like the workspace is so limited compared to my LG. For apps with proper scaling this is not an issue, but e.g. I tried to take a screen shot of an e-mail from outlook app on both devices, and the lower screen resolution did indeed result in a much tighter-cut image. Can’t say I liked that. :P Sure, I agree, more resolution would be better. But again it should not be the focus of that phone, the keyboard should be. Sure it is expensive compared to “budget-china” phones. And I am using one of these at the moment. But I mean if you compare it to an iphone or a galaxy it is not that expensive. And the pro1 has actually something that makes it special. Sure I would never spend an iphone amount of money on a phone, and 650 is also on the more expensive site for me, but at least you get something. I mean if there would be a cheap phone with a keyboard I would maybe go for that, but there is no alternative here. But you are right for longer delays. It gets harder and harder to sell the price, if they need another year it will get critical. But a month or two is fine in my opinion. Just because the big companies get away with over pricing their devices, doesn't mean it is right and that it is then okay to do so. I hate this mindset that "but apple does it, so it is okay". The budget brands really shows how much the big companies rip customers off with their prices. And unlike small brands with low production rates, Apple and Samsung shouldn't need to take so much profit margin per device; in fact it should be the other way around. But of course, if they can, they will. It is the customers that are stupid for buying into the pricing schemes. I would also exploit that. Obviously. My point was: If a budget phone at 400 dollars can have QHD screen, snapdragon 855 and 8 GB RAM and 128 GB storage, a phone like Pro1 - spec-wise - should only cost like 200-250 dollars (yes it is old tech). Then we can add in the additional costs of R&D for the keyboard up to 350 dollars and a profit margin up to 400-450 dollars. FInally I can see that it is a niche product and low-production number, increase that to 500 dollars. That would be a much more logical price point imho. Again, these calculations are then based on assumptions, but also comparing to what a 400 dollar phone can bring to the table these days. Again, because this in a way is a first-gen product, and a niche product, I am accepting the premium cost for this device. But make no mistake that this device is very overpriced for what it is. And please stop using Apple/Samsung overpricing as an excuse. But this is not the topic of this thread. Let's focus now on getting a release date out of the devs. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Doktor Oswaldo 904 Posted July 2, 2019 Share Posted July 2, 2019 Again, because this in a way is a first-gen product, and a niche product, I am accepting the premium cost for this device. But make no mistake that this device is very overpriced for what it is. And please stop using Apple/Samsung overpricing as an excuse. But this is not the topic of this thread. Let’s focus now on getting a release date out of the devs. I will end this topic in this thread, but I have to say you may have understood my incorrectly. I do not try to take apples or samsungs prices as excuse. I am the first one to point out the disgusting prices of apple (a grand for a display stand... hahahaha). I am just saying you shouldn't compare it to the budget phones either. There are differences beside the specs. We do not know much about build quality, materials, fair conditions for the people assembling the phone and so on (Not that apple or samsung has these). You know there are dacias, peugeots and mercedes with similar specs, and you may need to compare it to peugeot not to dacia and not to mercedes. Feel free to answer that comment, I will stop this discussion in this thread now (finally). Sorry but couldn't live looking like I think the iphone prices are okay Quote Link to post Share on other sites
EskeRahn 5,427 Posted July 2, 2019 Share Posted July 2, 2019 My point was: If a budget phone at 400 dollars can have QHD screen, snapdragon 855 and 8 GB RAM and 128 GB storage, a phone like Pro1 – spec-wise – should only cost like 200-250 dollars (yes it is old tech). Then we can add in the additional costs of R&D for the keyboard up to 350 dollars and a profit margin up to 400-450 dollars. FInally I can see that it is a niche product and low-production number, increase that to 500 dollars. That would be a much more logical price point imho. If you can do a competitor you can sell at that price, then please do... I would love a slightly more compact device, And some have asked for a non-curved display.... But to get realistic, you forget one VERY important aspect in your R&D calculus: VOLUME! What you are looking at is the marginal cost between number say 100000 and 100001, and sure that could be like the numbers you suggests. If you have an expected sell of a million devices or more, every 5 million spent in R&D, marketing etc is just £5 per device. But I think they will be over-joyed if they sell even 100000! And that would be £50 per device... But if they (God forbid) sell only 10000 devices the distributed cost is £500... So to even talk 'profit' we should be talking substantial volume. I do not know the numbers for their R&D, nor the amount they expect to sell. But I VERY much doubt they will get aPple-greed-rich by this project.... But if they do, good for them, and most likely for us too, as this will increase the chance for a Pro2, 3, .... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
netman 1,424 Posted July 2, 2019 Share Posted July 2, 2019 A newsletter just landed in my mailbox! And it reads: "Once we have the confirmed shipping date, we will be requesting payment for the Pro1 you have pre-ordered. We anticipate that payment will be requested at the end of July, ahead of an expected shipment date in early September." :). Quote Link to post Share on other sites
EskeRahn 5,427 Posted July 2, 2019 Share Posted July 2, 2019 It really is time they did another blog post ....You got psychic powers? They just sent out an e-mail... *LOL* Among other things it says We anticipate that payment will be requested at the end of July, ahead of an expected shipment date in early September. But also requests for beta-testers, so if you are as impatient as me that might be an option to become one of the lucky ones.... ADD: @netman, you are fast :) Quote Link to post Share on other sites
glumreaper 144 Posted July 2, 2019 Share Posted July 2, 2019 Just got the same! September is a little disappointing, but it's still good to hear from them. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Doktor Oswaldo 904 Posted July 2, 2019 Share Posted July 2, 2019 Wish me luck for a beta device, I may be able to bridge the time between the day my current device dies and September :D Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Swond 120 Posted July 2, 2019 Share Posted July 2, 2019 Wish me luck for a beta device, I may be able to bridge the time between the day my current device dies and September :D Same here!! :D Mine won´t die, but the memory still says no space and it does not matter there is almost one GB free :D Its annoying :-/ Just thinking, how many BETA testers are interrested. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
aznfantasystar 5 Posted July 2, 2019 Share Posted July 2, 2019 I also applied for a beta test application, but I won't be hurting for a device if I get denied. From the previous 2 comments; it does not sound very safe to replace a daily driver with a phone that's less-than stable. Especially, if work/family depends on the ability to stay connected. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
VaZso 1,997 Posted July 2, 2019 Share Posted July 2, 2019 However, if someone has another cards to test with, the stability may not be as important. For example, I have an older pre-paid SIM at one of the providers in Hungary which was used to be a number for someone, but had to be topped up yearly, thus, it currently has relatively high amount of money. So it would be good for initiating and also receiving calls from friends / family. I also have a separate card with active mobile internet - this way stability is not as important as there is a fallback phone with my main personal and company number :-) However, that way two phones should be used in parallel, but who cares... :-) Quote Link to post Share on other sites
EskeRahn 5,427 Posted July 2, 2019 Share Posted July 2, 2019 I also applied for a beta test application, but I won’t be hurting for a device if I get denied. From the previous 2 comments; it does not sound very safe to replace a daily driver with a phone that’s less-than stable. Especially, if work/family depends on the ability to stay connected. I plan to use a second number/SIM (already bought for the purpose), and then optimistacally set the primary SIM in the Beta, an the secondary number in my old device. And hopefully the old will seldom be needed. Worst case I will swap the SIMs Quote Link to post Share on other sites
_DW_ 628 Posted July 2, 2019 Share Posted July 2, 2019 Yeah I've had the email as well they got spammed (my email provider couldn't validate them) I applied for beta test as well, they will need the help to do the final polishing of this device. I don't have a problem using it as a daily phone can't be as bad as my current one that keeps stalling and overheating :D Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Tim6263 134 Posted July 2, 2019 Share Posted July 2, 2019 I applied for beta test as well, they will need the help to do the final polishing of this device. I don’t have a problem using it as a daily phone can’t be as bad as my current one that keeps stalling and overheating :D Me, too, applied for Beta; & likewise my current handset is getting v.v. dodgy, so I would have no worries beta testing the Pro1 as my primary phone! ? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Hook 2,945 Posted July 2, 2019 Share Posted July 2, 2019 I would imagine most folks would volunteer to beta test. Myself included. I imagine the form they said they will send will have the sorting variables. Region (they might want a sampling from different regions)? Experience/Technical knowledge? Use cases? Random drawing (lol)? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
MortisAngelus 2 Posted July 2, 2019 Share Posted July 2, 2019 Please enlighten me if I am wrong here, but I have never heard of bad software screwing up your SIM-cards, so I don't understand why people are so hesitant to try the BETA-phone as their daily driver. If I get the beta-test, I will absolutely try to use it as my main phone and see where it holds up and where it doesn't. Or can bad OS brick SIM-cards? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
VaZso 1,997 Posted July 2, 2019 Share Posted July 2, 2019 Or can bad OS brick SIM-cards? I don't think so. For me, it would be also my primary device (doing most of the use cases on this device), maybe even with my primary SIM, but there may be cases when the device is not available - like software upgrades, regressions, anything. I think beta testers definitely have to use the device in everyday life to be able to find out possible problems. Maybe also by doing tests with one SIM, two SIMs, different radio bands (also in different countries / places around the world) would also be good. At least to have some feedback of earlier measurements in real world experience. Anyway, when you (your team / any team) do something, there are many things you will not notice. Sometimes may happen that someone comes in and instantly finds something you never thought about - just because we are different. Even non-technical people can help a lot in this, including overall usability. For SIM cards, it has phonebook functionality, SMS memory, maybe some applications which modern phones (systems) are usually don't use at all. It has to be driven at proper voltage levels at hardware side, but this will not be a problem. PIN codes are handled by software functions, should also be okay. I don't think you have anything to be afraid of. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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