SchattengestaIt 553 Posted March 10 Share Posted March 10 (edited) So I ended up building my own phone. Backstory: A few of you know me for my hardware modding adventures. I've replaced the broken USB port with a new port. I've then removed the fingerprint sensor to replace it with a secondary USB port for a more comfortable landscape mode. I filed away some parts of the display mount to make it more durable and I was about to replace the battery while reusing the old BMS. I did all of that to make my Pro1 work as I wouldn't want to live without a keyboard phone. Sadly, the issues didn't stop. The camera quality is bad, it's horrible in low light situations. My new display (a-ware not available) already had black dots in the corners. After a few months, a small black dot appeared in the middle of the screen and a line of broken pixels grew to the side of the phone. I've also had some slight microphone issues, visual bugs, keyboard bugs and so on. But the phone was still usable with those. However, a few weeks ago, the GPS stopped working. There are no replacement parts, so I ended up using a different phone for navigation. This started a whole new thought. What if... I built my own slider phone? I remembered EskeRahns attempts with bluetooth keyboards so I tried it myself. First, I used a lot of scotch tape and hard wire to try out different hinge designs and mounting points. The Pro1 hinge design didn't quite work for me but I found a different design that looked promising. I then bought some thin hinges from the hardware store and glued them onto the components while using cardboard to try out different mounting positions for the future phone. Every change meant that I had to change the position of the hinges. Again and again... Tips: - fold your scotch tape to make a two sided tape and put it below your hinges. That way, they don't move so much onto the keyboard/phone/other hinge. - keep your phone cover in mind as it adds 2-3mm on each side. I then used a dremel to cut a bit into the hinge mechanism. You want to bend a small part of it upwards to make your tilting mechanism stop at a certain point. Otherwise, the display would just fall over on the other side. If you fail in your first attempt, just try at a different part of the hinge. It will still work fine. One part of the hinge is glued onto the phone cover, the other one is screwed (plastic screws) into the keyboard case. See the process and result in the pictures below. I really like this first version of my own keyboard slider. It has some disadvantages as it's self-built, but it really has some great advantages too. In overall, I'd still prefer the Pro1 if there were (affordable) replacement parts and better hardware options. But my daily driver will be the self-built phone. Comparison to the Pro1: Pros: - Little cost (<50€ without the phone), up to date phone, phone of your choice - there are REPLACEMENT PARTS for both your phone and keyboard - you now have a mouse/trackpad! - the keyboard connects very fast. It takes 1-2 seconds either from standby or when shut off. - no reliability issues as ribbon cable, sliding mechanism, buttons, etc. - better phone hardware (i.e. camera, processor, etc.) - perfectly usable with Windows Remote - you have a delay in your inputs but you can use all web interfaces and programs on your computer with your phone keyboard. - easy and cheap replacement of hinges and the keyboard itself - phone is removable and usable without the keyboard and cover (i.e. navigation) - better impact protection thanks to the cover - no strange keyboard/overlay bugs Cons: - thicc: 2.2cm (Pro1 1.3cm // the astro slide has 1.8cm and costs 1100€...) - louder keyboard than Pro1 - that's the worst part in my view - the keyboard turns off when it's not used. This causes Netflix to reload. You should shut it off when watching a movie - no sticky shift (I'm happy for that since it always caused bugs with my Pro1) - phone tilts over when upside down (i.e. holding over your head), while the Pro1 stays in place. You may be able to change that with a more complex design. - the bundle is very top heavy: it will tilt over when placed on a table. However, you can flip the display 180° to watch movies comfortably. -> you could also increase the internal battery (maybe even include a power bank!) as you have lots of empty space in the keyboard case. Neutral: the keyboard is different. The keys are louder so it might be annoying to use in bed while your partner tries to fall to sleep. The keyboard design of the Pro1 (qwertz) is quite perfect in my mind. The Rii Mini 6 isn't. Enter and backspace are weardly positioned and you sadly don't have a right shift (!!) and right crtl. I experienced that with thumb and index finger you can adapt to type majuscule letters quite fast. I feared not having a Delete key anymore but you can use it with FN+backspace. AltGr can be used as Alt. I love having a mouse! I always wanted to add a small mouse somehow and now it's already included. Since I always use very high resoultion and very small element size, that's very helpful. And if you want to click away ads with your sausage fingers, it helps too. But mainly I'm looking forward on emulating Age of Empires or such games. With the Pro1 it wasn't really that much fun. You also got separate arrow keys and left/right click buttons. Tapping things (double tap) works out great though and you can scroll with FN+mousepad. Cost: 100€ phone (Galaxy S9, used, very good condition) 25€ keyboard (Rii Mini i6) 10€ cheap case with plastic elements 3€ thin hinges (1.30€ each), I ended up using two and destroying one some thin plastic screws, a heated thin nail to melt the holes for your screws Images: Sadly, it seems we can't upload images anymore (max 2MB in total).Hinge design and first prototype: https://imgur.com/a/PaKRqF7 Development: https://imgur.com/a/owwroEd Final version (video) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pUZs2xNawWE Edited April 20 by SchattengestaIt Added video 9 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Hook 2,834 Posted March 10 Share Posted March 10 Brilliant! And, maybe, our future. 3 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
jakfish 121 Posted March 10 Share Posted March 10 A most excellent arrangement, and thanks for the imurgs (I was wondering how you would make actual calls, and your pix explain). When I had a Galaxy S5, I found a laptop-ish bt kb for it: a shell built for the S5, and it swung open for typing or you could put the kb against the phone's back for calling, etc. The kb was pretty spongy and I must admit I didn't use it much past proof-of-concept. Your rig seems more useful. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
SchattengestaIt 553 Posted March 10 Author Share Posted March 10 Thank you guys! If anybody wants to rebuild this setup, feel free to ask any questions here or via PM. I'll report how it works as a daily driver in a few months but right now I'm very optimistic. The keyboard feels better than my Pro1 which is already quite worn out. I personally also like that you don't always hit the display when using the top row of the keyboard and you have actual F1-F12 keys. 3 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Flash-a-holic 39 Posted March 11 Share Posted March 11 14 hours ago, jakfish said: A most excellent arrangement, and thanks for the imurgs (I was wondering how you would make actual calls, and your pix explain). When I had a Galaxy S5, I found a laptop-ish bt kb for it: a shell built for the S5, and it swung open for typing or you could put the kb against the phone's back for calling, etc. The kb was pretty spongy and I must admit I didn't use it much past proof-of-concept. Your rig seems more useful. I had similar approach many years ago when I bought iPhone 6 bluetooth case for Xiaomi Mi4c. I had to make some modifications for the case but it was quite ok. See more below. It seems that you wre still able to buy those cases: https://www.boxwave.com/apple-iphone-6-cases-and-covers/keyboard-buddy-apple-iphone-6-case/bwpdd/pkz-pkgw/ https://community.fxtec.com/topic/2127-i-built-my-own-keyboard-phone-here039s-what-i-learned/?tab=comments#comment-33164 BTW have you guys seen https://www.clicks.tech/? New Blackberry style keyboard case for iPhone. 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
SchattengestaIt 553 Posted March 11 Author Share Posted March 11 40 minutes ago, Flash-a-holic said: https://community.fxtec.com/topic/2127-i-built-my-own-keyboard-phone-here039s-what-i-learned/?tab=comments#comment-33164 I like the approach you had there. The mechanism seems very stable, exactly like the Droid 4. Was this a bluetooth keyboard included in a case or did you build that yourself? 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
eldarion 46 Posted March 11 Share Posted March 11 (edited) 4 hours ago, Flash-a-holic said: BTW have you guys seen https://www.clicks.tech/? New Blackberry style keyboard case for iPhone. https://www.clicks.tech/about literally the same building as fxtec. I am not 100% sure it's them but the probability of it being a coincidence is very low (checking on streetview and it's not like it's a giant office with hundreds of companies there). The fact that they don't mention that they are fxtec is very fishy IMO. It's like they perfected this scheme of launching a credible site with lots of FAQ and order options and then it catastrophically fails. I would avoid that project like the plague until it hits the shelves or is available to directly order. They already tried something like this and I did not work out ( https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/keyboard-mod-a-physical-keyboard-for-the-moto-z#/updates/all ) though they did offer pro1 vouchers and some refunds I believe (?) (for all the good it does to have gotten that voucher...) I mean it's nice that they are trying and I do want them to succeed but the track record so far is so bad that it is almost certainly a management issue. Edited March 11 by eldarion better link to moto mod campaign as this includes the detailed timeline and reasons for canceling the project 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
FlyingAntero 817 Posted March 11 Share Posted March 11 6 hours ago, eldarion said: https://www.clicks.tech/about literally the same building as fxtec. I am not 100% sure it's them but the probability of it being a coincidence is very low (checking on streetview and it's not like it's a giant office with hundreds of companies there). The fact that they don't mention that they are fxtec is very fishy IMO. It's like they perfected this scheme of launching a credible site with lots of FAQ and order options and then it catastrophically fails. I think that we can't say only based on address if clicks tech people are F(x)tech. According to the Verge, clicks tech company is founded by MrMobile (Michael Fisher) and CrackBerry Kevin (Kevin Michaluk). To my knowledge these guys are not working at F(x)tec. But sure it is interesting that the building is the same. - https://www.theverge.com/2024/1/4/24024957/clicks-iphone-keyboard-case-iphone-14-15-lightning-usb-c 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Rob. S. 1,617 Posted March 11 Share Posted March 11 1 hour ago, FlyingAntero said: But sure it is interesting that the building is the same. Interesting indeed. There are quite a few companies at that address according to https://www.192.com/places/wc/wc2a-3/wc2a-3th/. They don't list F(x)tec, though, whatever that means. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
SchattengestaIt 553 Posted March 11 Author Share Posted March 11 A lot of times, stuff gets produced and is sold by different companies. I don't think that FxTec is clickstec but I could imagine they work with the same supplier. And who knows, maybe one company copied the idea of the other when they heard what they are doing. I mean to remember that FxTec failed with the Moto Case since they didn't launch the phone like they meant to (click-on external hardware connected to te phone). I don't remember the details but I'm quite sure it wasn't FxTec's fault. FxTec also succeeded in building a great phone. The mass production just never worked out. If we look at their competitor AstroSlide, they didn't do much better. Many people are still waiting on their phones. The small company size and then CoVid and other crisis certainly didn't help. I still hope they will manage to deliver all orders and maybe even launch a second version. But next time they should get sponsors to manufacture them before letting people pay. And we need replacement parts to keep our phones working. If they did the same design with better hardware, a lot of people would buy it. Aaand we also had some replacement parts. 5 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
jakfish 121 Posted March 11 Share Posted March 11 This was my rig. I pulled the custom shell for S5 to substitute a Pixel 4a, and the fishing line is my own primitive workaround to keep it from flipping over. The type on the handle are my key remappings for em dashes, etc. 5 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
eldarion 46 Posted March 12 Share Posted March 12 (edited) 15 hours ago, SchattengestaIt said: A lot of times, stuff gets produced and is sold by different companies. I don't think that FxTec is clickstec but I could imagine they work with the same supplier. And who knows, maybe one company copied the idea of the other when they heard what they are doing. https://suite.endole.co.uk/insight/company/14816776-clicks-technology-ltd?page=people-contacts but it is undoubtedly them. The company lists Adrien and Chen as company directors, among others The moto mod campaign failed because (among others) Motorola basically left the mod market to die after claiming they would help with marketing etc. It's quite well documented in the indiegogo I linked (at that time livermorium/fxtec was quite good at communicating and being transparent). edit: by the way it's also mentioned in the launch video https://youtu.be/e2n2ftM-MwI?t=199 so it's not really a secret Edited March 12 by eldarion 1 3 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
FlyingAntero 817 Posted March 12 Share Posted March 12 6 minutes ago, eldarion said: https://suite.endole.co.uk/insight/company/14816776-clicks-technology-ltd?page=people-contacts but it is undoubtedly them. The company lists Adrien and Chen as company directors, among others The moto mod campaign failed because (among others) Motorola basically left the mod market to die after claiming they would help with marketing etc. It's quite well documented in the indiegogo I linked (at that time livermorium/fxtec was quite good at communicating and being transparent). Yeah, that confirms your previous conclusion. You are definitely right! 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
SchattengestaIt 553 Posted March 12 Author Share Posted March 12 I love the detectives on this forum. You seem to be correct, Adrian is listed for multiple companies, all being not too successful: https://suite.endole.co.uk/insight/people/14137907-mr-adrian-chen-kee-li-mow-ching Liangchen is officially only working for Clicks technology. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
SchattengestaIt 553 Posted March 12 Author Share Posted March 12 @jakfish I really love the fishing line setup. It may be primitive but it seems to work fine. If you added a secondary fishing line on the back, maybe connected to some fancy mechanism, you could also fix the display in place for long time use. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
EskeRahn 5,350 Posted March 12 Share Posted March 12 2 hours ago, SchattengestaIt said: Liangchen is officially only working for Clicks technology. erhm??? https://suite.endole.co.uk/insight/people/24248551-mr-liangchen-chen https://suite.endole.co.uk/insight/people/24248551-mr-liangchen-chen?page=companies But the page might not be accurate, I'm quite sure he was (/is?) involved in https://suite.endole.co.uk/insight/company/09345044-livermorium-limited too. And clicking the link shows him as "product manager" there, so some of that data are not cross referenced correctly on the page..... Quote Link to post Share on other sites
EskeRahn 5,350 Posted March 12 Share Posted March 12 3 minutes ago, EskeRahn said: erhm??? AH!! They got him registered with two different numbers.... https://suite.endole.co.uk/insight/people/24248551-mr-liangchen-chen https://suite.endole.co.uk/insight/people/30814671-mr-liangchen-chen 4 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
MonCon 116 Posted March 12 Share Posted March 12 Companies House may add a bit of clarity: https://find-and-update.company-information.service.gov.uk/company/11602958 or confusion 3 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
EskeRahn 5,350 Posted March 12 Share Posted March 12 12 minutes ago, MonCon said: Companies House may add a bit of clarity: https://find-and-update.company-information.service.gov.uk/company/11602958 or confusion It seems to be the same data, at first glance at the least, but I guess your .gov.uk link is the authoritative base, from which other sites pull data. https://find-and-update.company-information.service.gov.uk/officers/Pt7zKAA7fzLqJbJ77pn3yCCD60o/appointments https://find-and-update.company-information.service.gov.uk/officers/9_JtS_IaTpZPYyNQtsQTefcMF6Y/appointments 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
dt.white 62 Posted March 13 Share Posted March 13 (edited) On 3/11/2024 at 10:01 AM, eldarion said: https://www.clicks.tech/about literally the same building as fxtec. I am not 100% sure it's them but the probability of it being a coincidence is very low (checking on streetview and it's not like it's a giant office with hundreds of companies there). I know this is now venturing off topic but just to clarify, the address that the company is using is related to a law firm (Edwin Coe). It is not unusual for companies (at least in the UK) to set up their registered office as their solicitors', and so I imagine there will be any number of companies registered to that address. Obviously in this case it is something that has linked two companies together (with further evidence of filings) but please don't be under the illusion that any and all companies registered at a single address are related to each other in any way other than potentially the law firm they've used for company registry (there are also other service providers than law firms that do this for you, too). Edited March 13 by dt.white *Coe, not Come 3 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
belletrist 56 Posted March 15 Share Posted March 15 How suitable is the Rii Mini i6 keyboard for a mobile phone? Does anyone else have another idea for a suitable keyboard? The reason I ask is that I wouldn't mind having a shot at designing a 3D printable case/hinge to fill the gap that FxTec has left us with. The benefit would be that we can use any phone with it with small adjustments. I'm thinking something similar to the Pro1(x) style as it is beautiful, though might be unattainable as it uses a half size keyboard. The width would be the real killer as it would add an extra ~6 to 10 mm to the phone/keyboard combo. This could be mitigated a bit if the keyboard length is smaller than the phone. At the end of the day you could easily pop out the phone when the keyboard is not needed. Please take this with a grain of salt ATM, while I do have a few ideas floating around in my head, nothing has been tested yet. My main motivation for this is that I'm on borrowed time ATM with the lack of VoLTE in Australia and 3G is close to shutting down and I love my keyboard phones! 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
SchattengestaIt 553 Posted March 15 Author Share Posted March 15 The Rii i6 was the best keyboard I could find. I've searched for a long time (it's quite difficult since you mostly get 'mini' keyboards in laptop size) and I think it fits well. Since a Samsung S9 is still wider than the Rii i6, the width doesn't really matter. Size: 15.1 x 5.9 x 1.1 cm - the Pro1 is slightly longer than the keyboard. 1 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
EskeRahn 5,350 Posted March 16 Share Posted March 16 Talking S9, they were clearly prepared for a click-on keyboard like the predecessors, but it was never released. There was a thread on that in XDA, and I have a post on it for S8 here. (Though it was obviously in the wrong direction, it was not a terribly bad solution/workaround) Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Flash-a-holic 39 Posted March 16 Share Posted March 16 17 hours ago, belletrist said: How suitable is the Rii Mini i6 keyboard for a mobile phone? Does anyone else have another idea for a suitable keyboard? The reason I ask is that I wouldn't mind having a shot at designing a 3D printable case/hinge to fill the gap that FxTec has left us with. The benefit would be that we can use any phone with it with small adjustments. I'm thinking something similar to the Pro1(x) style as it is beautiful, though might be unattainable as it uses a half size keyboard. The width would be the real killer as it would add an extra ~6 to 10 mm to the phone/keyboard combo. This could be mitigated a bit if the keyboard length is smaller than the phone. At the end of the day you could easily pop out the phone when the keyboard is not needed. Please take this with a grain of salt ATM, while I do have a few ideas floating around in my head, nothing has been tested yet. My main motivation for this is that I'm on borrowed time ATM with the lack of VoLTE in Australia and 3G is close to shutting down and I love my keyboard phones! One possibility is to find a small bluetooth keyboard that can fit inside normal phone case. Then you could just buy 2pcs of cases and put phone and keyboard to own cases. In the end you could build the sliding mechanism with magnets (see Jolla the other half keyboard) or something else. Here is video and couple pictures if the idea. https://youtu.be/FqYX0ZbC5uA?si=itPnKwmK2GAorypX I think that another Rii keyboard could be usefull (4.3 x 2.3 x 0.4 inches so 10,9 x 5,8 x 1,0 cm) https://www.amazon.com/Rii-Bluetooth-Rechargeable-Handhelds-PS3-BLACK/dp/B0B46F8RS6 4 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
FlyingAntero 817 Posted March 30 Share Posted March 30 I ordered the Rii 518BT bluetooth keyboard (USB-C variant) and couple cases so that I can build my own slider phone. Let's see how it goes. I have Zenfone 9 which has dimension 146.5 x 68.1 x 9.1 mm so there should be enough room to built sliding mechanism when the keyboard is attached. Camera hole still needs some tinkering thought. You can see my idea below. For the sliding mechanism I am using magnets inside a plastic rail. The rail is actually a cable cover but seems to be solid with the magnets. First I tried to develop tilting mechanism similar to Astro Slide but since I do not have 3D printer or other special tools it was too difficult. Current idea is cheap and simple. Still waiting the keyboard to arrive. I will give update when it arrives. 1 4 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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