Keyboard print layouts and functionality

[MortisAngelus 2]

+1 for swedish layout – option with printed Ä,Å,Ö and no missplaced keys.

 

 

 

nidajeny wrote:

+1 for swedish layout – option with printed Ä,Å,Ö and no missplaced keys.

+1 for swedish qwerty

 

Hey, don't be ignorant, lol! It is NORDIC qwerty. :P There are other countries than Sweden, you know! Not sure about Island, but Finland, Sweden, Norway and Denmark all use the same qwerty-layout.

 

No, not trying to be mean, just a bit nitpicky. ;-)

[EskeRahn 5,399]

Hey, don’t be ignorant, lol! It is NORDIC qwerty. :P There are other countries than Sweden, you know! Not sure about Island, but Finland, Sweden, Norway and Denmark all use the same qwerty-layout.

 

No, not trying to be mean, just a bit nitpicky. ;-)

 

Well Norway, Denmark and Sweden use ALMOST the same layout... (Norwegian as Swedish with different symbols Ä->Æ, Ö-> Ø, and Danish as Norwegian but with Æ/Ø swapped...). So for cheaper laptops we often see a common keyboard with three colours of letters on these three keys...

[MortisAngelus 2]

Go here to find a poll on what keyboard type you wish for!

 

https://www.fxtec.com/forums/topic/poll-what-keyboard-layout-do-you-want/

[raphaelcno 21]

Here is a proposal for the Nordic/Scandinavian keyboard layout, based on the German QWERTZ layout (https://www.fxtec.com/forums/topic/design-the-qwertz-layout/page/12/#post-14233):

 

[attachment file=F(x) - Scandinavian QWERTY - 2019-05-13_2_RCa.png]

 

Variant 2 with ' and * on Ä and Ö is closer to the desktop keyboard layout, but these two keys look a little overloaded. Variant 1 is easier to read.

 

For reference, here are the main differences between Swedish, Norwegian and Danish keyboards ( |, \, ÖØÆ, ÄÆØ):

 

[attachment file=F(x) - Differences between Scandinavian keyboards - 2019-05-13_RCa.png]

 

[EskeRahn 5,399]

Here is a proposal for the Nordic/Scandinavian keyboard layout, based on the German QWERTZ layout (https://www.fxtec.com/forums/topic/design-the-qwertz-layout/page/12/#post-14233):

 

I really don't like the three characters printed that way, but unfortunately I do not have a better idea, as different colours would also look ugly (and most likely would add to the cost). Now if only the Danes did not swap the two, one could have been 'creative' and printed the Ö with a thin slash and dots. And similar the Ä/Æ could have been printed as an A with a thin E and dots.... I bet both Swedes and Norwegians could live with that... Like this quick mock-up

 

[attachment file=14623]

 

 

[raphaelcno 21]

I really don’t like the three characters printed that way, but unfortunately I do not have a better idea, as different colours would also look ugly (and most likely would add to the cost). Now if only the Danes did not swap the two, one could have been ‘creative’ and printed the Ö with a thin slash and dots. And similar the Ä/Æ could have been printed as an A with a thin E and dots…. I bet both Swedes and Norwegians could live with that… Like this quick mock-up

 

 

It could be a solution, but I'm not sure if Waxberry would be able to write these two combined characters, as they don't have a Unicode and need to be "assembled" manually.

 

I have a black desktop keyboard with the three characters on each key, and I have just put some black tape on the characters which are not relevant for me, it works fine :-)

[MortisAngelus 2]

Here is a proposal for the Nordic/Scandinavian keyboard layout, based on the German QWERTZ layout (https://www.fxtec.com/forums/topic/design-the-qwertz-layout/page/12/#post-14233):

 

<span class="image-overlay overlay-type-image" style="left: -5px; top: -393.517px; overflow: hidden; display: block; height: 407px; width: 748px;"><span class="image-overlay-inside"></span></span>

 

Variant 2 with ‘ and * on Ä and Ö is closer to the desktop keyboard layout, but these two keys look a little overloaded. Variant 1 is easier to read.

 

For reference, here are the main differences between Swedish, Norwegian and Danish keyboards ( |, \, ÖØÆ, ÄÆØ):

 

<span class="image-overlay overlay-type-image" style="left: -5px; top: -677px; overflow: hidden; display: block; height: 690px; width: 570px;"><span class="image-overlay-inside"></span></span>

 

And just to make everything clear: FINLAND and SWEDEN uses identical keyboards. :D (Finland is usually always neglected in these kinds of discussions... Just saying. #FinlandMattersToo. )

[MortisAngelus 2]

Here is a proposal for the Nordic/Scandinavian keyboard layout, based on the German QWERTZ layout...

 

Just as a quick note: FINLAND and SWEDEN uses the same keyboard. Just saying. :P Finland is always so neglected in these kinds of discussions. #FinlandMattersToo

 

:D

[MortisAngelus 2]

Just got a reply from the dev team regarding pricing, shipping and keyboard layouts:

 

I asked the following:

 

1) Is it really true that EU-prices are including VAT and the only extra cost will be shipping?

 

2) How much the shipping to Sweden would be?

 

3) If I should order now or not in regards to those extra/additional keyboard layouts (i.e. non US QWERTY)

 

This was their reply:

 

[attachment file=14635]

 

My follow up question was then to ask them to clarify then if it is really unnecessary to pre-order now then, if one only wants a Scandi-Qwerty layout. Still waiting for response. I also asked if they might consider changing from a UK distributor to an e.g. German, due to the unreliability that is Brexit.

 

P.s. I also gave them a friendly reminder that it is somewhat illogical/ignorant to call only the US-layout "QWERTY" as the majority of layouts out there are in fact QWERTY with slight nation-specific variations. Not to mention USA has two different QWERTY layouts as well... (again; WHY?)

[ycs 3]

info1 wrote:

What is final QWERTY layout? Im not satified with one column of symobols on left side between “tab” key and “Q” key…

I do not think that it is 100% certain yet. But I’m pretty sure that the letters of the standard QWERTY delivered will be right shifted one key.

 

Personally I am likely to go for the German QWERTZ <span class="gdbbx-bbcode-underline" style="text-decoration: underline;">print</span> layout, accepting the Z/Y to have the print swapped to get the letters in their standard positions (better for languages with national letters, e.g. Danish for me). A few other keys would also have ‘wrong’ print, but I for one can live with that.

 

It might be an option to consider for those that do not want the partly shifted keyboard for whatever other reasons too.

 

You have true - we have two options - original keyboard (but shifted) with US prints or QWERTZ keyboard (non-shifted) with some prints, that we do not need. Now I preffer option two due to non-shited physical layout (Im Czech). I could be fine to persuade designers to think about more international prints on QWERTZ version. Everybod form IT, could accept it better than local types.

 

I hope, that we could see keyboard layouts before final order.

[raphaelcno 21]

Here is a proposal for the Nordic/Scandinavian keyboard layout, based on the German QWERTZ layout

 

Is it better to have the ~ sign on the N key or on the J key?

 

[attachment file=F(x) - Scandinavian QWERTY - 2019-05-14_RCa.png]

 

[raphaelcno 21]

I could be fine to persuade designers to think about more international prints on QWERTZ version.

 

If you have some specific ideas, you can make proposals in the QWERTZ layout thread https://www.fxtec.com/forums/topic/design-the-qwertz-layout/.

I guess it will be difficult to agree about which "international prints" should be added to the standard German QWERTZ layout.

 

[nidajeny 0]

I have read most things regarding keyboard layouts and have finally decided that qwertz trade-off not good enough for me. I do understand they can’t please everyone so I ready to wait and see some more country specific layout will appear.

Do I need to cancel my preOrder or can I just ignore the payment mail and FX understand that I wait for next generation QWERTY?

 

Hope to see this device ready next month.

[TeZtdevice 262]

I have read most things regarding keyboard layouts and have finally decided that qwertz trade-off not good enough for me. I do understand they can’t please everyone so I ready to wait and see some more country specific layout will appear.

 

Do I need to cancel my preOrder or can I just ignore the payment mail and FX understand that I wait for next generation QWERTY?

 

Hope to see this device ready next month.

 

Later, you switch to QWERTZ.

You don't have to cancel your order!

[MortisAngelus 2]

This might have been asked here already, but will it be possible to make the phone unlock when opening the keyboard? I know from a security stand point it is not ideal, but I really loved on my Xperia Pro that when I slid the phone open, android unlocked and I could immediately get into using/typing on the phone

[_DW_ 628]

This might have been asked here already, but will it be possible to make the phone unlock when opening the keyboard? I know from a security stand point it is not ideal, but I really loved on my Xperia Pro that when I slid the phone open, android unlocked and I could immediately get into using/typing on the phone

 

Wouldn't android let you do this I mean by disabling the lock screen. As at that point its useless anyway for that functionality

 

Hmm saying that changing pin to a password maybe better for your scenario with security.

[Swond 120]

This might have been asked here already, but will it be possible to make the phone unlock when opening the keyboard? I know from a security stand point it is not ideal, but I really loved on my Xperia Pro that when I slid the phone open, android unlocked and I could immediately get into using/typing on the phone

 

Indeed, still using this feature at my Nokia E7, but I guess when there is a fingerprint sensor at the side, you will reach it with your tip finger every time when you turn the phone 90° (what you have to do always when wanna to slide it) and at that moment the pin is not needed any more, because when sliding the keyboard, you can already unlock the phone only by holding it in the correct direction and with tip finger on the scanner, am I correct?

[EskeRahn 5,399]

Indeed, still using this feature at my Nokia E7, but I guess when there is a fingerprint sensor at the side, you will reach it with your tip finger every time when you turn the phone 90° (what you have to do always when wanna to slide it) and at that moment the pin is not needed any more, because when sliding the keyboard, you can already unlock the phone only by holding it in the correct direction and with tip finger on the scanner, am I correct?

 

You are correct. :)

The keyboard open does trigger just as pressing power, so if the device is not locked, it is active when opened.

If locked, it is just touching the scanner with the right index (or middle) finger after opening.

I feel it natural to hold the index finger at the 'support plate', that is between the two 'halves', which is close to the sensor, for easy access.

 

I think it is a matter of 'muscle memory' to find the ideal way to pick it up, slide open and unlock in one sweep (almost unconscious) movement.

 

BTW I noticed an alternative way of opening it(!), Rather than pushing the front edge, you can lift the back edge. That is ideal for a discrete opening, e.g. during a meeting, where the cool clang would draw attention.

 

You can even lift it from the table in the top half, and push the bottom half 'away' opening it while doing it...

[MortisAngelus 2]

MortisAngelus wrote:

This might have been asked here already, but will it be possible to make the phone unlock when opening the keyboard? I know from a security stand point it is not ideal, but I really loved on my Xperia Pro that when I slid the phone open, android unlocked and I could immediately get into using/typing on the phone

Wouldn’t android let you do this I mean by disabling the lock screen. As at that point its useless anyway for that functionality

 

Hmm saying that changing pin to a password maybe better for your scenario with security.

 

No because disabling the lock screen would then allow for pocket clicks and such. But sure, as many have said, the finger print reader is (hopefully) in such a good position it is easy to unlock just prior to opening the keyboard anyways. I was just curious, as I saw a video with someone using the pro1 sliding out the keyboard, but the phone remained locked - thus waking this question in my head.

[Swond 120]

Swond wrote:

You can even lift it from the table in the top half, and push the bottom half ‘away’ opening it while doing it…

 

Eske, what phone you are using? Wow, you did not find out earlier?? easyyyy, that is perfect for one hand opening :-D :-D Using it quite often!! :-D

[EskeRahn 5,399]

EskeRahn wrote:

Swond wrote:

You can even lift it from the table in the top half, and push the bottom half ‘away’ opening it while doing it…

Eske, what phone you are using? Wow, you did not find out earlier?? easyyyy, that is perfect for one hand opening :-D :-D Using it quite often!! :-D

 

He he, haven't had a real tilt slider since the N97mini ten years ago.... (Gave that up for the Xperia Neo Pro, as N97mini only works in the dark...)

[0xF 0]

Will Pro1 support Polish letters?

Ą ą = Alt+A

Ć ć = Alt+C

Ę ę = Alt+E

Ł ł = Alt+L

Ń ń = Alt+N

Ó ó = Alt+Ó

Ś ś = Alt+S

Ż ż = Alt+Z

Ź ź = Alt+X

[EskeRahn 5,399]

Will Pro1 support Polish letters?

Ą ą = Alt+A

Ć ć = Alt+C

Ę ę = Alt+E

Ł ł = Alt+L

Ń ń = Alt+N

Ó ó = Alt+Ó

Ś ś = Alt+S

Ż ż = Alt+Z

Ź ź = Alt+X

 

If I have my way, there will be no practical limits to what chars will be supported (well unicode accepted by Android). And my plan is that they can be assigned to any key or key-combination within some reasonable limits. (Zero or more modifier-keys plus some normal keys)

So any language using letters with individual unicode chars should be easy to map as wished.

 

To the extent Android supports it, it could even be taken a step further and supporting partial 'glyphs' or diacritics that can be used to combine chars from multi strokes. Either diacritics/modifiers pressed before or after, depending on the unicode element. As long at it is addressable, and Android supports the combining, I see no reasons to it being limited from the keyboard-end.

[agent008 238]

thomas_d

 

I have a Priv but don't know (maybe don't remember anymore?) how to do it. Since there's no 'ctrl' key, which key do you use instead?

 

Anyway, it will be nice to be able to use as many shortcuts / combinations as possible and make the keyboard ever more worth the wait!

[EskeRahn 5,399]

I have a Priv but don’t know (maybe don’t remember anymore?) how to do it. Since there’s no ‘ctrl’ key, which key do you use instead?

 

You can select to use one of the shift keys for Ctrl. I can not remember the exact place. Have to dig it up :)

Settings, Language&Input, Blackberry Keyboard Settings, Advanced, Physical Keyboard Ctrl key