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1 hour ago, kontakt said:

There might be a new bug. Since the update I can't access the settings of the updater anymore.

Do you mean the settings of "Auto check when connected to" ...wifi/etc, check interval, auto download, SD card update, etc?
Those settings still working for me (at least I can reach them).

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51 minutes ago, EskeRahn said:

Odd, works fine here. Have you tried a restart?

Restart didn´t work.

Going into the App details and deleting the stored data worked.

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And piling it on: Bug with keyboard backlight not turning back on is still there. Seems to indicate there are no fixes to the keyboard applied.

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Posted (edited)
28 minutes ago, ToniCipriani said:

And piling it on: Bug with keyboard backlight not turning back on is still there. Seems to indicate there are no fixes to the keyboard applied.

The fixes to the keyboard (multikey press) were made in the previous update.  The keyboard backlight was not addressed.

It is sounding more and more like this update was just to get the properly signed security update out.  I'm betting IdeaLTE hasn't been back to work that long and that F(x) Tec is not top prioroty. I'm just guessing.  I can't test anything because I am happily on LOS.

Edited by Hook
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36 minutes ago, Hook said:

The fixes to the keyboard (multikey press) were made in the previous update.  The keyboard backlight was not addressed.

It is sounding more and more like this update was just to get the properly signed security update out.  I'm betting IdeaLTE hasn't been back to work that long and that F(x) Tec is not top prioroty. I'm just guessing.  I can't test anything because I am happily on LOS.

Is the security proper on that? I keep getting suggestions to use Lineage (which I'm OK with, my TouchPad runs Cyanogenmod anyways), but I do use my phone for work as BYOD so I can't really tamper with the security settings and boot loaders.

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2 minutes ago, ToniCipriani said:

Is the security proper on that? I keep getting suggestions to use Lineage (which I'm OK with, my TouchPad runs Cyanogenmod anyways), but I do use my phone for work as BYOD so I can't really tamper with the security settings and boot loaders.

Yeah, I suspect that wouldn't work for you.  I have the luxury of not worrying about that.  When I worked, I never used my personal phone at work.  I made them give me a secure phone used only for work.  Now that I'm retired, well... 😄

Frankly, I just don't understand why people would voluntarily use their personal phone for work.

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Hook said:

Yeah, I suspect that wouldn't work for you.  I have the luxury of not worrying about that.  When I worked, I never used my personal phone at work.  I made them give me a secure phone used only for work.  Now that I'm retired, well... 😄

Frankly, I just don't understand why people would voluntarily use their personal phone for work.

 

I'm the opposite.  I just don't understand why people would voluntarily pay another bill if their company already was paying for it.

When work gave me a cellphone, I ported my number to it so that I wouldn't have to have two phones.  Why keep paying for my own service when I get it free from company?

But the smartphones offered had no keyboard.  And the SIM was AT&T.  So i bought my own photon q, hardware mod to add sim slot (thx cornholio), trimmed my company-paid SIM and put it in.   Best of both worlds.  Personal phone but company SIM.

Edited by Craig
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Posted (edited)
16 minutes ago, Craig said:

 

I'm the opposite.  I just don't understand why people would voluntarily pay another bill if their company already was paying for it.

When work gave me a cellphone, I ported my number to it so that I wouldn't have to have two phones.  Why keep paying for my own service when I get it free from company?

But the smartphones offered had no keyboard.  And the SIM was AT&T.  So i bought my own photon q, hardware mod to add sim slot (thx cornholio), trimmed my company-paid SIM and put it in.   Best of both worlds.  Personal phone but company SIM.

Guess I was never in a situation   where work offered to pay for personal use. In fact, we had regular audits to insure work resources were not used for personal purposes.

Still, I don't think I would.  That work phone went onto a bag at 3pm and was ignored until it came out again at 6am.  I like keeping work and life very separate.  

To each their own. 

Edited by Hook
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11 hours ago, ToniCipriani said:

Is the security proper on that? I keep getting suggestions to use Lineage (which I'm OK with, my TouchPad runs Cyanogenmod anyways), but I do use my phone for work as BYOD so I can't really tamper with the security settings and boot loaders.

 

As stated earlier, Secure Boot is disabled.  So no, security can never be "proper" on the Pro1.

 

But stock software and a locked bootloader should be able to pass corp checks since Android cannot "see" the Secure Boot setting.  Android does see the bootloader lock state and pretty much any security type software will flag that as unacceptable.  So no, you most likely cannot run Lineage with your corp stuff.  And then there's selinux which is not fully working in Lineage yet, so that's another issue for corp use.  There are workarounds (such as magisk and xposed), but I would never run them myself nor recommend them.

 

As for using a personal device on a corp net in general, I refuse to do it myself and I recommend against anyone else doing it.  Keep in mind that most any corp software is going to require admin access to the device.  This means that your corporate IT department can remotely wipe your device.  That includes not only all your apps, but all your local media storage (pictures, etc.)  All it takes is one guy clicking the wrong thing to ruin your day (or more likely your week).  I refuse to give that power to anyone.

 

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Posted (edited)

I vaguely remember seeing elsewhere in the forum that Google Pay won't work with Lineage because of SafetyNet, is that so?

Edited by lzb
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4 hours ago, lzb said:

I vaguely remember seeing elsewhere in the forum that Google Pay won't work with Lineage because of SafetyNet, is that so?

 

This is indeed true.   And although tdm implied magisk can workaround, I do not believe this to be the case any longer.  In my experience, the problems lack of safetynet cause are certain apps not in playstore (netflix, disney +) and no tap-to-pay. 

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Posted (edited)
On 6/23/2020 at 9:25 PM, Craig said:

Seems very disappointing reading this

Can anyone confirm *ANYTHING* at all was fixed in this (besides upstream security update that doesn't actually affect most people.) .

Very very very very disappointed.  I don't get why they're taking so long to fix the software.  Give one guy a week and $1000 and they could fix 90% of the problems, and lineage source is open so all those fixes are easy to copy.  

I can live with that if it means they bring Android 10 sooner 🙂 I doubt it though.

Edited by Slion

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14 hours ago, tdm said:

 

As stated earlier, Secure Boot is disabled.  So no, security can never be "proper" on the Pro1.

 

But stock software and a locked bootloader should be able to pass corp checks since Android cannot "see" the Secure Boot setting.  Android does see the bootloader lock state and pretty much any security type software will flag that as unacceptable.  So no, you most likely cannot run Lineage with your corp stuff.  And then there's selinux which is not fully working in Lineage yet, so that's another issue for corp use.  There are workarounds (such as magisk and xposed), but I would never run them myself nor recommend them.

 

As for using a personal device on a corp net in general, I refuse to do it myself and I recommend against anyone else doing it.  Keep in mind that most any corp software is going to require admin access to the device.  This means that your corporate IT department can remotely wipe your device.  That includes not only all your apps, but all your local media storage (pictures, etc.)  All it takes is one guy clicking the wrong thing to ruin your day (or more likely your week).  I refuse to give that power to anyone.

 

Depends on how they set it up. I didn't have to give that when I was using Good/BlackBerry Work, everything ran inside its own sandbox.

The stock firmware is working with my Office 365 + InTune right now, so I'll keep it as-is.

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4 hours ago, lzb said:

I vaguely remember seeing elsewhere in the forum that Google Pay won't work with Lineage because of SafetyNet, is that so?

OK definitely this is another dealbreaker for me. I have 2 cards that I use exclusively with Pay.

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7 hours ago, ToniCipriani said:

Depends on how they set it up. I didn't have to give that when I was using Good/BlackBerry Work, everything ran inside its own sandbox.

The stock firmware is working with my Office 365 + InTune right now, so I'll keep it as-is.

Same, I'm using O365 + Intune with stock firmware, both the previous one and the latest one from a few days ago, working great. This (office productivity) is one use case that this phone is a champ at. Love being able to use they keyboard for emails & Teams messages. 

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12 hours ago, Craig said:

And although tdm implied magisk can workaround, I do not believe this to be the case any longer.

Really? I thought that was the whole point of magisk, to hide root from the system and make it so that apps that require safetynet just see an unrooted and valid system. Then again, I haven't tried it myself. I don't use any apps that require safetynet. 

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8 hours ago, Zamasu said:

Really? I thought that was the whole point of magisk, to hide root from the system and make it so that apps that require safetynet just see an unrooted and valid system. Then again, I haven't tried it myself. I don't use any apps that require safetynet. 

Yes, that was one of its major points.  Google changes just made it impossible to workaround.

image.png.685b6403efc37d747fdc05c9a995a838.png

https://twitter.com/topjohnwu/status/1237656703929180160

 

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23 hours ago, Craig said:

Yes, that was one of its major points.  Google changes just made it impossible to workaround.

https://twitter.com/topjohnwu/status/1237656703929180160

But is it impossible already? Wu also said, "doesn't seem to be fully enforced yet" and [attempts to hack around are] "meaningless after this change is fully deployed AND properly implemented", but is it already, and will it be on all Android versions which are currently relevant for us, most importantly LOS 16?

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Posted (edited)

My understanding is yes.  My safetynet quit passing around March, I looked up why, and that's why.  Google pushes the update silently.  There's more info about it out there and I certainly could be wrong, but I gave up on my device passing safetynet anymore...

To the best of my knowledge the only way to past safetynet now is on stock software w/o root.

Edited by Craig
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Posted (edited)

Bummer.

I already feared that might be the case when I turned an Amazon Fire tablet into a usable device recently by flashing LineageOS and I couldn't get SafetyNet to fully pass with Magisk. Still, as that was the first time I attempted something like that, being happy enough that I managed to get LineageOS running at all, I thought I might have done something wrong. Not that I would need SafetyNet to pass on that device, though – Amazon Prime installs and runs, Netflix installs from APK, I'm not interested in Disney, and I don't run any other SafetyNet-sensitive apps on it.

On my phone, it's different. As far as I can see, I currently use four potentially SafetyNet-sensitive apps or services on what is still a Moto Z3 Play, which are Google Pay, an OTP app that authenticates me for remote work through my employer's VPN, my banking app (which has become mandatory for even just entering their homebanking website on my PC) and my health insurance's app. 

Google Pay is the one item I could do without, I only use it for contactless payments when I'm out shopping, and for a small fee I could get a chipped debit card from my bank instead. Or I could hold onto my old phone until December, at least for payments, until the card expires – the new one will come with NFC anyway. 

On the Amazon tablet, the other three apps don't appear in Play Store, but I managed to install them from apk (extraced from the Play Store over the web with https://apps.evozi.com/apk-downloader/) and start them all right, but I have yet to find out whether I can bind those apps to a Pro¹ device running LineageOS, log into them and actually use them for their purposes. 

If not, I can only use the stock system – and if this should turn out to be still as buggy as it is being reported to be when I finally get it, or even only have that call volume bug not fixed, I fear that the only thing I can do with it is to put it in the drawer, to try again if and when a bugfixed firmware might appear. As much as I have been craving that real keyboard phone now for so long and as much as I've been trying to support the manufacturer in this and other forums, I'm actually starting to play with the idea that I could also put it up for sale again right away in this case; I have better uses for that amount of money than to have it lying in my drawer for who knows how long...

Edited by Rob. S.
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At this rate it makes me think FXtec should really just ditch the company they are using, make Lineage the official OS and submit that certification...

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58 minutes ago, ToniCipriani said:

At this rate it makes me think FXtec should really just ditch the company they are using, make Lineage the official OS and submit that certification...

Is that an option for them? Can they call it Android then? Does it have Google services?

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1 hour ago, Slion said:

Is that an option for them? Can they call it Android then? Does it have Google services?

 

No and yes.  Lineage itself does not have GMS (aka. gapps).  FxTec could take Lineage as a base and add GMS, but that has some big pitfalls.  The biggest is trying to get certified, because nobody really knows if Lineage passes CTS (certification tests).  These can be a real pain to get working.

 

The better option is to actually develop the current stock software.  Lineage (and many other Android custom ROM projects) are open source and various bug fixes and features can be picked from them.  It doesn't take much to make a huge difference in usability.  As others have mentioned, my Lineage Pro1 device tree has a handful of super simple fixes that would be trivial to incorporate into stock.

 

Unfortunately, my understanding is that IdeaLTE does all of the software and FxTec does not even have a software team.  Being a hardware company, IdeaLTE is pretty terrible at software and undoubtedly invests as little as possible into their software team because that eats into profits.  And given the current situation, I don't expect FxTec is making enough money to hire software developers.  Even without covid19, I don't think they were making much.

 

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