On the pre-production status

[Doktor Oswaldo 904]

Just now, SteffenWi said:

Sorry, the word 'private' in that place doesn't make sense to me in that context. From your post I'm guessing there is a difference between airfreight and private airfreight...? I just saw the Twitter post and since it is a statement and not meant as a reaction to another post, I figured it was a clarification on how stuff is delivered.

Well the difference is, that the plane does not belong to FxTec and is also not chartered by FxTec, but FxTec sends the batch with a logistics company which does merge several parcels into the same plane.
As far as I understand the Twitter it just says that the logistic company does not work over the weekend. So they have to wait for them.

[SteffenWi 139]

18 minutes ago, Doktor Oswaldo said:

Well the difference is, that the plane does not belong to FxTec and is also not chartered by FxTec, but FxTec sends the batch with a logistics company which does merge several parcels into the same plane.
As far as I understand the Twitter it just says that the logistic company does not work over the weekend. So they have to wait for them.

oh. Well. I figured everyone knew that already. Thanks for clarifying.

[netman 1,424]

 

[agent008 243]

1 hour ago, netman said:

 

More good news! Wait for it.... waaait for it..... 🤣

[glumreaper 144]

I'm not sure how to read that? Is that next batch on its way from China? Or is that the stock that people had confirmed now being shipped to them?

I guess it's the latter.

[david 929]

3 hours ago, netman said:

 

Seems like we have different terms being used at different points in time.  I think the common understanding was that they have a factory in China and they have fulfillment centers in different countries where they ship the phones too and then they are processed in those locations by people paid by fxtec to package and sort and put customer addresses on them, etc.  Then they are mailed/shipped via normal means. 

Now it seems like we have:

A)  Factory where the phones are made in China

B)  Warehouses in multiple countries where the phones are shipped to from China and where all the processing happens.

C)  Fulfillment center = Fed Ex, UPS, USPS, etc.  Handle only the shipping.

Anyone else see this differently?  The reason is matters is because we can't tell the true status of the order if we don't know what the terms mean. 😄

[david 929]

6 minutes ago, glumreaper said:

I'm not sure how to read that? Is that next batch on its way from China? Or is that the stock that people had confirmed now being shipped to them?

I guess it's the latter.

I think he's still talking about the first batch.  The second batch = "more is being built and will be on its way."

[windraver 63]

I wouldn't consider Fed Ex, UPS, USPS to be fulfillment centers. They handle shipping but they definitely aren't fulfillment "partners".

I used to work in supply chain and usually fulfillment partners are actual warehouse companies that effectively store product until they're given and order to ship. The would then acquire a tracking ID and apply it to given order and ship the product at that time.

In this case, with all the preorders, they will literally acquire product from freight and move to shipping it immediately. These fulfillment partners are all over the globe and are used as they are more familiar with local regulations and processes. They also enable companies to have a better regional footprint and thus deliver quicker when orders are made.

Unfortunately for us, they aren't "stocked" yet as the freight is enroute it seems thus why some of us don't have tracking IDs yet.

I didn't catch it but did the folks who got their tracking ID mention their regions? Usually fulfillment centers are broken down to Americas, EMEA(Europe), APAC(Asia Pacific). My guess is their Hong Kong batch is the APAC and given the distance of Hong Kong from China, I would take it that APAC would fulfill first.

edit: Another note is that Fedex would track the package across the globe and would have already provided a tracking ID. I think this is more likely that Fxtec might have misworded fulfillment center or mistakened Fedex's business as a fulfillment partner. They are likely using a 3rd party fulfillment model:

Reason for this assumption is the cost of building out fulfillment centers across the globe is too costly for this company size. They certainly aren't going with self fulfillment because we'd otherwise all have tracking IDs coming directly from China and it would indeed be Fedex doing shipment and they would be able to provide all tracking IDs. This however has significant costs as well given Fedex is more a last mile delivery business and that costs a lot.

Edited November 6, 2019 by windraver

[david 929]

6 minutes ago, windraver said:

I wouldn't consider Fed Ex, UPS, USPS to be fulfillment centers. They handle shipping but they definitely aren't fulfillment "partners".

I wouldn't either.  But the question isn't what we would call them. The question is what Chen is calling them.  It seems he is calling FedEx the fulfillment center and now there is a warehouse concept that is what we all assumed were the "fulfillment centers" before.

I take his Tweet to mean that the phones have been processed in at least one destination country and are now on their way to the shipper (what he is calling a fulfillment center), like FedEx, and once they are dropped off at FedEx (or equivalent), they will get tracking numbers.

Edited November 6, 2019 by david

[EskeRahn 5,459]

36 minutes ago, david said:

Seems like we have different terms being used at different points in time.  I think the common understanding was that they have a factory in China and they have fulfillment centers in different countries where they ship the phones too and then they are processed in those locations by people paid by fxtec to package and sort and put customer addresses on them, etc.  Then they are mailed/shipped via normal means. 

Now it seems like we have:

A)  Factory where the phones are made in China

B)  Warehouses in multiple countries where the phones are shipped to from China and where all the processing happens.

C)  Fulfillment center = Fed Ex, UPS, USPS, etc.  Handle only the shipping.

Anyone else see this differently?  The reason is matters is because we can't tell the true status of the order if we don't know what the terms mean. 😄

Guessing here I think the confusion comes in as what previously has been labelled "Fulfilment warehouses", are here labelled "Warehouses", and the "Fulfilment centre (like FedEx)" is part of what was previously just called "shipping" as clearly a shipping partner.

[EskeRahn 5,459]

16 minutes ago, david said:

I wouldn't either.  But the question isn't what we would call them. The question is what Chen is calling them.  It seems he is calling FedEx the fulfillment center and now there is a warehouse concept that is what we all assumed were the "fulfillment centers" before.

They have talked about "Fulfilment Warehouses". Not "Fulfilment centres" AFAIK.

ADD: Just did a search, both terms have been used, but primarily the first (by them)

[david 929]

1 minute ago, EskeRahn said:

Guessing here I think the confusion comes in as what previously has been labelled "Fulfilment warehouses", are here labelled "Warehouses", and the "Fulfilment centre (like FedEx)" is part of what was previously just called "shipping" as clearly a shipping partner.

Yep, that is my guess too.  I didn't remember them being called Fulfillment warehouses, but that's probably just my memory being imperfect.  😂 

[david 929]

3 minutes ago, EskeRahn said:

They have talked about "Fulfilment Warehouses". Not "Fulfilment centres" AFAIK.

Got it. Thanks for pointing that out.

I searched the forums and I see where Erik called them Fulfillment Warehouses, and when I commented on his post, I changed that to "Fulfillment Centers", to be more clear, because I felt that "warehouses" might be confused as "factory" to some people.  If *I* was naming things, I would call them:

A) Factory

B) Fulfillment Centers (or any number of other terms, like Regional Hub, Regional Processing Centers, etc.)

C) Shippers

This could be an American vs UK English language thing, but I believe the above would be least confusing to American English readers.

But I just wanted to be sure we understood what he was stating. Seems like we're on the same page that they have made it into at least one destination country and are heading to the shipper.  The customers serviced by that/those shipper(s) will receive tracking numbers shortly and then the phones will be in transit to the end customers (finally).

Edited November 6, 2019 by david

[Siani_8 105]

At this very moment a batch of phones is being shipped to the ship which will ship them to the shipping location from which the shipper will ship them to their shipping destination...at some point. 

[david 929]

1 hour ago, Siani_8 said:

At this very moment a batch of phones is being shipped to the ship which will ship them to the shipping location from which the shipper will ship them to their shipping destination...at some point. 

As sad as it is, there are even 3 more hops in there, in reality, and that batch hasn't left yet.  But to be fair, the ship is an airship, thankfully.  😂

A modified version:  At some point, a batch of phones will be shipped from the source of all these shipments, to the shipping interceptor, that ensures they are in ship shape, and then shipped to the airship, which will ship them to other shipping interceptors, that ensure they are in ship shape, and then shipped to those who will shape them to ship and ship them to the shippers, who will ship them to the shipping destinations...at some point.

[SchattengestaIt 559]

Is my thought too simple to basically see it as a 3-step shipping? Factory - warehouse in EU, USA and probably Asia - custome5.

 

Factory: production of devices, shipping in batches to the warehouses

Warehouse: located in diffetent continents. Batches get sent there by air (shipping multiple devices is cheaper than single shipping to each customer around the world) and then get shipped personally to the customer

Customer: The last step of shipping, ideally done as close to the warehouse as possible.

 

While the first batch was first sent to the warehouse (fulfillment center), the devices are now (or very soon) on their way to the customer. I don't see a contradiction there but I read a lot of strange interpretations...

[elvissteinjr 359]

The biggest mystery in all of this for me is the Hong Kong fulfillment center. If I got that right, all units went there first and then got split up by region or sent directly to a customer.
Not a single non-US/EU customer has told us about them getting any tracking number. And I feel like Fx would not hesitate to tell us that a device has finally successfully arrived somewhere.

[david 929]

1 hour ago, SchattengestaIt said:

Is my thought too simple to basically see it as a 3-step shipping? Factory - warehouse in EU, USA and probably Asia - custome5.

Those are the main stops, but there are other stops along the way. There is a export customs in China and there is an import customs in each destination country.  That can delay the phones by 1 to N days the source country and destination country.  The theory is that the customs delay could decrease with future batches vs early batches.

[david 929]

59 minutes ago, elvissteinjr said:

The biggest mystery in all of this for me is the Hong Kong fulfillment center. If I got that right, all units went there first and then got split up by region or sent directly to a customer.
Not a single non-US/EU customer has told us about them getting any tracking number. And I feel like Fx would not hesitate to tell us that a device has finally successfully arrived somewhere.

Agreed.  That's quite a mystery.

[PandaBearCorgi 3]

18 hours ago, theory said:

Starting to get concerned here...

My pre-order was placed on 09MAR2019...  #83xx

I got my payment request email on 31JUL2019

Paid $698.54 on 01AUG2019.

So, where does that place me in the queue?

Some of you seem to be complaining about order numbers in the 30000 range...

Just curious. 

My first good chance to show it off at our trade show has come and gone...  I expected to have it by 01OCT2019

Lots of people in my field would love something like this for remote network management...

--

I ordered mine the day after you.
F(X)tec support told me to expect my phone the second week of November and that I was part of the 2nd batch.

So that would imply the 1st and 2nd batch should arrive in November.
But who really knows.

[david 929]

9 minutes ago, PandaBearCorgi said:

F(X)tec support told me to expect my phone the second week of November and that I was part of the 2nd batch.

Wow.  If that is true, then maybe they are starting to under promise and over deliver.  Stating that the 2nd batch is leaving China mid-November (stated previously) could be the under promise part.  This would also make sense, as they said at an earlier point in time that they would be sending batches out within days of reach other and then it was more recently changed to weeks.  Saying it is weeks and then having people get them sooner would be a good move on their part.

If this does end up being true, it would also make a huge difference for the company regarding Christmas sales.  My concern is if they can only get the the remaining pre-orders to customers by mid-Dec (3rd batch, assuming 2nd leaves mid-Nov and 3rd leaves end of Nov), it will result in far fewer people choosing the Pro1 for a Christmas gift than if they can get the pre-orders done around the 3rd week in Nov.

We'd all like them to sell as many phones as possible, as it increases the ability for them to bring another phone to market.

I guess time will tell what the real story is for how fast they can get these batches out and what the lag time ends up being from China to customer hands.

Just to be clear, you are saying they said to expect to *receive* your phone the second week of November for the 2nd batch?  Or expect your phone to be "shipped" to you the second week of November?  The latter has lately been their way of saying it is leaving the Chinese factory.

[PandaBearCorgi 3]

35 minutes ago, david said:

Just to be clear, you are saying they said to expect to *receive* your phone the second week of November for the 2nd batch?  Or expect your phone to be "shipped" to you the second week of November?  The latter has lately been their way of saying it is leaving the Chinese factory.

"Realistically, your order will be shipped with the 2nd batch due to arrive in mid-November."

Sorry I said second week, I meant mid-November.
Unfortunately wording isn't specific as to where it's arriving, just that it is arriving somewhere between the second and third week of November.

Still though this response reignited my hopes that I receive it before the end of November, however it's anybody's guess at this point.

[david 929]

12 minutes ago, PandaBearCorgi said:

"Realistically, your order will be shipped with the 2nd batch due to arrive in mid-November."

Sorry I said second week, I meant mid-November.
Unfortunately wording isn't specific as to where it's arriving, just that it is arriving somewhere between the second and third week of November.

Still though this response reignited my hopes that I receive it before the end of November, however it's anybody's guess at this point.

They are so slippery with wording.  That could very well mean due to arrive at the door of the factory in mid-Nov.  In other words, it could be another way to say that the batch will be ready mid-Nov, not meaning that it will arrive in customer hands.

[Gon009 70]

1 hour ago, david said:

Wow.  If that is true, then maybe they are starting to under promise and over deliver.  Stating that the 2nd batch is leaving China mid-November (stated previously) could be the under promise part.  This would also make sense, as they said at an earlier point in time that they would be sending batches out within days of reach other and then it was more recently changed to weeks.  Saying it is weeks and then having people get them sooner would be a good move on their part.

If this does end up being true, it would also make a huge difference for the company regarding Christmas sales.  My concern is if they can only get the the remaining pre-orders to customers by mid-Dec (3rd batch, assuming 2nd leaves mid-Nov and 3rd leaves end of Nov), it will result in far fewer people choosing the Pro1 for a Christmas gift than if they can get the pre-orders done around the 3rd week in Nov.

We'd all like them to sell as many phones as possible, as it increases the ability for them to bring another phone to market.

I guess time will tell what the real story is for how fast they can get these batches out and what the lag time ends up being from China to customer hands.

Just to be clear, you are saying they said to expect to *receive* your phone the second week of November for the 2nd batch?  Or expect your phone to be "shipped" to you the second week of November?  The latter has lately been their way of saying it is leaving the Chinese factory.

I am in 3rd batch and support said that phone will be delivered by end of November but honestly I don't believe that even if they exactly said "delivered". If it was true then 3rd batch should leave factory next week but we all can be sure that 2nd batch is probably still in factory. However support also told me that they aren't being told about everything what is happening with shipments and I guess it is a person above them who creates confusion.

All that confusion is probably because people in Fxtec who handle contracts with factory/shipment companies are trying to hide everything what isn't related to first batch from people like it is some sort of national security thing. Support and probably also Eric aren't allowed to know what is happening. So small company, so many secrets...

[SchattengestaIt 559]

4 hours ago, david said:

Just to be clear, you are saying they said to expect to *receive* your phone the second week of November for the 2nd batch?  Or expect your phone to be "shipped" to you the second week of November?  The latter has lately been their way of saying it is leaving the Chinese factory.

I asked specifically when I would receive my device (regular order in mid-october) and they told me that all preorders should receive their device by end of November (shipping from factory starts mid-November).

They were also optimistic to complete shipping all orders until then, definitely before christmas.